In a message dated 12/13/2005 6:58:35 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, MarcatoGSD@xxxxxxx writes: Yes, we do. But why? In a message dated 12/13/2005 8:56:02 PM Central Standard Time, edwinx@xxxxxxxxxxxxx writes: we have one standard, but we show two different types of dogs It has developed for a number of reasons. It started that the all-breed shows would not give a large ring. Also, many of the judges were more used to a dog breed that didn't prize movement so much. So, at that point a German shepherd that was very controlled, looked great stacked, and didn't need to cover as much ground, often was the winner. As more and more of the judges who were not that versed in the Standard saw who was winning, that type won more and more in the all-breed ring. The handlers learned that to show in a small ring the dog had to poise, move exactly without any looseness and be "on" every minute in a small ring. The handlers learned to bring those dogs to the smaller ring. You seldom see a German shepherd being baited in a Specialty ring, but when Jimmie takes someone into the all-breed show, he will always stand in front of the dog and "bait" the dog, so the judge sees the dog poised and holding the stack. When I used to show in an all-breed ring I learned to slow down, show on a short lead, keep the lead tight, (with my hand less than a foot away from the dog), and the dog under perfect control. It was the only way to show in an all-breed ring, that often only allowed four or five steps on a side. As judges learn our breed, and as more and more Specialty judges judge the all-breed ring, the style is becoming less important and movement appreciated. We are getting larger rings and better judges. It is still true that a "picture" dog can win at the all-breed ring, (if the judge is used to breeds that emphasize type) and at the Specialty ring, require more movement. A dog with great movement and fantastic style, (Scoop for example) will win in both rings. To be honest, there are not two types of dogs, THERE ARE TWO TYPES OF JUDGES. A good judge is a good judge, no matter what ring they are judging in. Evan _Asgard German Shepherds_ (http://www.asgardgsd.com/) http://www.asgardgsd.com/ Where Type Movement and Temperament come together ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2005. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - http://www.showgsd.org ============================================================================