In a message dated 4/1/2006 9:47:37 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, pmick@xxxxxxxxx writes: but I'd do a section any time rather than risk losing the bitch just because I couldn't wait for her to get on with it. For me it's never been about being impatient about the bitch "getting on with it"; (I work from home, I can put clients on hold, so believe me, I'm in no hurry and I don't leave mom's side anyway) ~ it's been about getting puppies out alive once mom begins to tire. I'll tell you though, today's posts have been eye openers. I don't doubt that kennel help gave Helen's bitch pit WHILE SHE WAS HAVING CONTRACTIONS (!!!!), and I can't imagine anyone (continuing to) "shoot a bitch full of pit" as Peggy says not realizing that if a puppy isn't born after one shot (and I always walk the gal), that something is wrong, you have the possibility of a puppy in a bad position or worse, you could even have a horn of the uterus twisted, although I don't doubt for a minute that in careless hands it's been done ~ nor can I fathom not being able to tell if there is a puppy in the birth canal, but I will say I've had WONDERFUL teachers, so THANK YOU to them:) With all of these horror stories and people not knowing what they are doing it's become abundantly clear to me why some vets are reluctant to prescribe pit! (You know, this is a good idea for a regional club educational program and I'm going to follow thru with it and put a panel together!) I'll still not whelp a litter without pit though. I'm pretty certain I would have lost two out of the last litter of eleven without it. I knew we didn't have all the placentas and I weighed a "clean out" shot against putting my gal on antibiotics to ward off possible infection. The pit shot with the added benefit of increasing milk production won out over the possible side effects of the puppies having loose stools from mom being on antibiotics, but, I admit, it was a toss up and on another day I might have made a different decision. Kathy three generations of Dual Titled Champions live here! visit _Pine Hill German Shepherd Dogs_ (http://www.geocities.com/pinehillgsds/) ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2006. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - URL temporarily deleted due to AOL issues ============================================================================