Karen In our kennels we have crushed rock down about 3-4 inches thick, covered by the 1" thick Red Barn stall mats, thick , cushy, about 100lbs apiece, and you can cut the 4 x 6 mat to fit if need be. They clean well and are very kind on the dogs orthopedically. Over the top of the mats we put just small bit of pine shavings to stop the "splash factor" for the dogs, esp the males. lol. There is no mud, no problem disinfecting, they drain beautifully as they are on a bit of a grade from back to front. The dogs sprawl out on the mats, and are very happy with them. The only drawback is that the mats are awkward to carry, and that dogs' nails will need cutting more often because the mats do not wear them down at all. Great investment. Kathy Gray Home of CH. ELVASTON'S NATIONS CUP, TC, OFA H/E DNA'D "NITRO" 24 BISS/ BESTS OF BREED TO DATE _Victory German Shepherds_ (http://www.victorygermanshepherds.com/index.htm) ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2005. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - http://www.showgsd.org ============================================================================