[ SHOWGSD-L ] Re: I guess a different opinion equals disrespect
- From: "Nancy Harper Mulvaney " <nancy@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <dmarc-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>, <showgsd-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Wed, 21 May 2014 16:30:36 -0400
Tina,
You are correct - oversized dogs/bitches aren't what the standard calls for;
not all breeders produce 28,29,or 30 inch GSD's.
Should we change the standard to accommodate the larger dogs just because
they are out there? Obviously the answer is a resounding NO.
It is not uncommon throughout the history of a breed, any breed, for that
matter, for various faults to rise to the top only to eventually
be pushed back & tucked behind a closed door to control undesirable
genetics. In our GS breed history, breeders have been "awed" by the
unexpected appearance of an outstanding GSD. With few exceptions, those of
us who breed to the best of our ability,
and wish to present what we have breed by way of competition recognize this
outstanding individual and want to incorporate the
qualities exhibited by the dog. This dog produces his wonderful qualities
and so he is used profusely though several generations.
Eventually,the faults will also rise to the top and now breeders must work
to bring the pendulum back to center.
As Joan Fox pointed out, those folks in the middle of the ring that are
pointing the finger, bear a huge responsibility - they in some ways,
dictate the direction of the breed. We should keep in mind however, that
judge can only judge what is brought before him/her.
It simply does not make sense to change our Standard because there are
dog/bitches that are being shown and bred that are not
good examples of the correct GSD as described in our Standard.
As for the change in our Standard regarding teeth. At one point in time it
was not uncommon for those at ring side
to be able to see right through a gapping mouth as a competing dog in the
ring began to pant. More and more teeth were missing as
breeders concentrated on other physical characteristics. Knowledgeable
breeders became concerned, how could a dog with
multiple missing teeth perform the job they were bred for? So the Standard
was changed to PROTECT THE BREED.
Another example of a PROTECTIVE change in the GSD Standard was the inclusion
of a statement penalizing an exhibit for unsound character. Very important.
If exhibits
today are not being penalized for poor temperament should be change the
Standard to make that OK? If judges do not penalize poor temperament is
not due to
a faulty Standard
As for pigment, there was a time in our History that we began to see more
and more dogs exhibiting very pale pigment, "washed out" dogs with no
saddles, & white toenails .
A warning sign that genetically we had better take note, it had already been
established that rich, dark colors were preferred. Why, because Shepherds
with
strong to good pigment typically exuded a true "Shepherd Look" Just as a
solid white Boxer, Doberman, or Great Dane would not look like a typical
Boxer,
Doberman, or Great Dane etc. It has to do with the "Look of Eagles"
difficult to define" but 'UNMISTABLE WHEN PRESENT" . Please do not
misunderstand,
this is not a "put down" on white shepherds as we all know there are many
white shepherds that are smart, dependable, great companions, good workers,
and
sound of gait. Do they "look different? Yes, they do look different
They simply do not LOOK like a black and tan, red & black, or sable just as
blues, & livers don't . To change the Standard to have Whites competing in
the AKC ring with pigmented GS's does not serve to protect the breed as it
is known which, is the only VALID reason to change a well written Standard.
What it WOULD DO is satisfy the owner and breeder of the White GS Dog by
acknowledging the white is "just as good as the pigmented Shepherd" and
"DESERVES" to compete IN THE AKC RING - AFTERALL THE WHITE IS a true GS Dog.
Again this is not an open criticism of White Shepherds as such, only an
attempt to explain there is a difference in the overall "LOOK". A look that
has been developed since our GS Founder in Germany registered the first GSD.
It was inevitable that whites were part of the development of the breed as
most all old Herding stock from throughout Europe descended from various
dogs having whites in the Background. The early dedicated and reliable
breeders from the 1930's forward have deliberately bred out the white
shepherd, establishing the LOOK of the present day Shepherd Dog as it is
recognized today. For those that prefer the White Shepherd that is their
PERSONAL decision & PREFERENCE. Those breeders have chosen a different path
- that path veers AWAY from that part of the Standard that identifies the
TRUE GERMAN SHEPHERD LOOK.
Nancy Harper- Mulvaney
-----Original Message-----
From: showgsd-l-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:showgsd-l-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
On Behalf Of Christina Klahn (Redacted sender "ducksavsfan@xxxxxxxxx" for
DMARC)
Sent: Wednesday, May 21, 2014 10:04 AM
To: showgsd-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [ SHOWGSD-L ] Re: I guess a different opinion equals disrespect
I agree with that 100%, the breeders are the guardians of the standard. So
why then, are people breeding to the dogs in question? Every time I ask
that question, it's met with "well the dog has X-Y-Z on the other end."
What about the fact that A-B-C is being propagated? I would like to pull
one example. Everyone is worried about what bringing whites back into the
fold will do. What about breeding these drastically oversized dogs? I
believe the GSD is supposed to be a medium sized herding dog, per the
standard. How is 28, 29, 30" and 100+ pounds medium sized? If we keep
breeding that, won't our dogs just keep getting bigger? How is a dog that
size supposed to be a herding dog designed to work all day? Again, I'm not
being disrespectful, I'm asking in total curiosity.
I once again will say I don't feel that removing the white DQ or the long
coat fault is going to cause the huge issues people are bringing up.
Worried about white feet or pandas? What about the white chests you see in
dogs now, that again, are being bred and carry that forward? You aren't
going to see a white dog winning in the AKC ring, not likely anyhow, though
I guess it's possible. I like the possibility of the coats getting their
deserved championships. Dogs that are otherwise completely over looked
because of one obvious fault. I would love for someone to give me a
legitimate reason why these things shouldn't happen other than people don't
like it, because that's not a good enough argument to me.
Again, no disrespect, so please stop the knee jerk reaction. I'm truly
interested in the subject at hand and having an educated discussion on the
matter. If someone can give me the legitimate reason, maybe that will
change my mind. It just seems those things are grossly over worried about,
especially considering all the health issues that people don't seem to mind
breeding to.
Tina Klahn
Illusion GSDs
ducksavsfan@xxxxxxxxx
Date: Wed, 21 May 2014 04:42:49 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Joan Fox" <dmarc-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> (Redacted sender
"campaignersgsd@xxxxxxxxx" for DMARC)
Subject: Re: I guess a different opinion equals disrespect
Tina,
It is up to the judges to put up the dogs that are closest to the Standard.
It is up to the breeders to breed the most correct dog possible.
The standard is clear and needs no revision.
Joan F. Fox
17500 Haskins Rd.
Chagrin Falls, Ohio 44023
tel: 440-759-4119
http://www.campaignersgsds.com
On Tuesday, May 20, 2014 9:53 PM, "cherpa@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx"
<cherpa@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
>
>I agree People
>
>Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On May 20, 2014, at 6:45 PM, "Tina Klahn" <dmarc-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
(Redacted sender "ducksavsfan@xxxxxxxxx" for DMARC) wrote:
>>
>> I don't mean to disrespect anyone. I just don't like when people scream
"standard" with long coats and whites, but it's okay to have dogs that can't
walk normal, are 30" tall or can't even be touched and get rewarded for it.
It's extremely frustrating and again, I was not attacking anyone or any dog.
Simply stating that people need to not just complain when something doesn't
agree with what they believe and state it's a violation of the standard.
>>
>> P.S. I wasn't being condescending with me comment of "that's
>> awesome." I meant it whole heartedly. I'm glad to hear of dogs that
>> can do it all. :)
>>
>> Tina
>>
>>
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POST is Copyrighted 2014. All material remains the property of the original
author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind
are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the
Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED.
Each Author is responsible for the content of his/her post. This group and its
administrators are not responsible for the comments or opinions expressed in
any post.
ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY
MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS
PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY
FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE
PROSECUTED.
For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxx
VISIT OUR WEBSITE - http://showgsd.org SUBSCRIPTION:
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NATIONAL BLOG - http://gsdnational.blogspot.com/
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