Hi Pam; For Judges to put up the "best dog" period.....they absolutely MUST know the Standard! For you to show the best dog ......you also need to know the Standard. The Standard on the German Shepherd Dog REQUIRES and explains the powerful thrust of the rear drive in good detail......under GAIT: 'General Impression'. i.e. "The hindquarter's deliver, through the back, a powerful forward thrust which slightly lifts the whole animal and drives the body forward. REACHING FAR UNDER, and PASSING the imprint left by the front foot"............ "The overeach of the hindquarter usually necessitates one hind foot passing outside and the other hind foot passing inside the track of the forefeet, and such action is not faulty unless the locomotion is crabwise"............ This is a direct quote from the German Shepherd Dog Standard. Explain how the STANDARD can be "incorrect".......?? It is after all what makes this Breed what it is..... Linda Shaw's articles are not the Standard. You need to spend your time studying the actual GSD Standard and not someone's incorrect illustrations or opinions. This powerful driving thrust off the rear of the German Shepherd Dog is part of what sets it apart from all other Breeds. For those of us who Breed according to the Standard and have watched the gait in function while the dogs herd......it is a beautiful powerful, athletic result of the correct construction of an efficient trotting working breed......and it is beautifully described in our GSD Standard. I am not at all offended at your "opinion"......but just want to remind you it is only an opinion as compared to our actual Standard. You are correct though in respect to saying we need more Judges who actually read and understand the Standard. But we also need more Breeders and Exhibitors with the same responsibility to knowing the Standard. I wholly appreciate your great love and respect for this amazing Breed and feel exactly the same way. I just want to remind you that they can be what the Standard requires with the awesome rear drive that propels them forward with the atheletic powerful thrust....and still be willing to lay their life on the line for you. ALL the details of the Standard are what makes this Breed unique and perfect. Thanks for your post.......it is a good reminder to all of us to brush up on our Standard occasionally. Carolyn marhaven@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx www.Marhaven.com ----- Original Message ----- From: culzeans1@xxxxxxx To: showgsd-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Sent: Monday, November 26, 2007 7:46 AMSubject: [ SHOWGSD-L ] judges We need more judges who actually read and understand the standard and PUT up the best dog,period.?The dog should be balanced, nothing over done in any area. The shepherd movement is one of grace, power and stamina. Anything over done detracts from that. To over reach is incorrect with or without crabbing. The more I learn, the more I learn, the more I learn and the more I learn....? I have been studying Kathy Shaw's articles and I am amazed at how many different "types" of shepherds there are and not suprising is the arguing over who has the "right" or "correct" dog according to the standard. If you look at what she illustrates according to the standard, most of us have a dog that fits into the standard, more or less, some much less than more. It really comes down to what we want our shepherds to do. If all you want is a dog with a great side gait, well that is what you get. Over reaching accomplishes that. I want a dog that more than anything can do everything, even go into the water and retrieve that bird if I ask them to. And to accomplish that I feel I must have a dog right down the middle of the standard. Nothing over done, no over reaching, no under reaching,?no toe dragging, no hock walking, no cow hock,no roach back, no to short stiffled, no to short or to long back, no to long or to short neck,no block heads, no snipey heads,?good feet and pasterns, temperament suited to adapt to what ever I ask of them. I know many people have been in this breed way longer than I have, have a billion more champions than I do(because I have none yet), feel offended that I even have an opinion, but I put my love of this breed up against anyones and I will stand toe to toe with you because my life has been saved by this breed and I will stand for the best in them because it is no less than what this noble incorruptable breed would do for me. I love reading this list because I see here people who have differences of what our breed should look like, but who have a love for this breed as I do. I have been to shows and been treated poorly by GSD people and I have been to specialties and had such a wonderful time, granted they thought my dogs were not "extreme" enough but still people were pleasant and helpful. I love that the breed I love so?much has so many people looking after its best interests. Maybe we just need judges who feel the same. Pam ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2007. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. 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