And while we are talking German here, there are many dyed dogs there. I have warned people in the past that if you want to improve pigment don't breed to a orange dog. :0) Terry who loves the black and tans most of all. --- On Tue, 10/7/08, Carolyn Martello <marhaven@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: From: Carolyn Martello <marhaven@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> Subject: [ SHOWGSD-L ] Re: Dye /pigment and Drugs just wondering To: dan-ann@xxxxxxxx, "Cinosam GSD" <cinosamgsd@xxxxxxxxx>, "freelist" <showgsd-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Date: Tuesday, October 7, 2008, 10:19 PM Sometimes there is a misunderstanding about "color" vs. "pigment" in my opinion. While we all love some of the brilliant 'reds' we see in the German dogs.....notice it is not necessarily the best PIGMENT all the time. MANY are beautiful orange/red......but with the receding saddles that the black does not even reach past halfway down on the ribbing....and if you get close enough many have lighter toenails.....not the black toenails ....and seldom do they have the black eyes we want to see. The typical dark black saddle dog with the tan 'not so red' is usually very dark in "pigment" with a solid black saddle.....black eyes and black toenails. Guess which will be most likely to give you fading pigment............. It is when the red dogs have the deep black on the rest of the dog that you truly have beautiful rich dark pigment. Carolyn marhaven@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx www.Marhaven.com ----- Original Message ----- From: sally To: Cinosam GSD ; freelist Sent: Tuesday, October 07, 2008 3:34 PM Subject: [ SHOWGSD-L ] Re: Dye and Drugs just wondering I certainly don't rank color before health and structure but if I were still breeding I would do a lot more checking.I would not want that to happen again. What I did not add before is that a lot of the progeny I saw and did not realize had a color adjustment done Sally www.embroiderybysally.org new designs ===========================================================================POST is Copyrighted 2008. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - http://showgsd.org NATIONAL BLOG - http://gsdnational.blogspot.com/ =========================================================================== ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2008. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - http://showgsd.org NATIONAL BLOG - http://gsdnational.blogspot.com/ ============================================================================