In a message dated 7/9/2006 9:38:17 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, mary@xxxxxxxxxxxxx writes: But there are judges who find fault with this. Mary But Mary, I don't know any GSD whose incisors are level, meaning "even with" and the same size/height as the one next to it. They would look capped, for goodness sakes! (OK, maybe an older dog who is in the habit of chewing fence or one who is aggressive w/ toys), but look at any dog and the center incisors are one size smaller than the ones moving outwards. Here's a link from a skeletal view from Washington State University: _http://www.vetmed.wsu.edu/ClientED/anatomy/dog_digest.asp#teeth_ (http://www.vetmed.wsu.edu/ClientED/anatomy/dog_digest.asp#teeth) If judges are faultin' that in GSDs, then either they have a LOT of near perfect specimens in their ring (NOT!) or they don't have a clue. To answer D.D.'s original post, there's so many other things to consider besides incisors...(general impression including balance, proportion, correct shoulder/rear angles, correct length of upper arm AND stifle, <too many short upper arms and long, weak stifles IMO>, correct backs, <HATE a soft back!>, croups that are THERE, not "created" w/ a de-matting comb and "on right" and not too steep or short and non-existent, dogs whose legs are on straight, not pointin' in every direction; ALL things that affect movement)... Then there are things I personally can't live with...the "subjective" part, I guess, once we get beyond the "major" stuff... (light or rounded eyes, bad/soft/wide ear set, horrible feet, soft/weak pasterns <could be listed above too>, kinks in tails, backs/loins that you could scramble an egg on <ditto, list above too>....things that make you go "yuck!", <G>, etc. etc., etc.) Now, I'm not a judge, I'm talking about what I can live with here, or what I'll take a chance on and grow out.... I want a nice depth of body after 18 months, but I'll overlook a little legginess until then; same for "nice, well sprung" ribs...a youngster who is a little slab sided won't worry me, conversely, one that is too "done" at a year to 18 months may very well end up too low on leg and too barrel sided. I'll grow one out who is wide coming at me as a youngster (my best fronts started slightly wide) and I'll forgive a LITTLE sloppiness behind as they grow and learn to use their rear, but you won't see them out and about when they go through this. <G> I don't care what color they are, though my favorite is a rich black and reddish tan. You can correct pigment in one generation. I do prefer plenty of coat, (easier to work with and still enough there to show when they blow coat), but I'd keep a dry dog (again, lol!). Kathy three generations of Dual Titled Champions live here! visit _Pine Hill German Shepherd Dogs_ (http://www.geocities.com/pinehillgsds/) ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2006. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - URL temporarily deleted due to AOL issues ============================================================================