How did you get to "some disdain for conformation showing" from where the conversation was Christine? Talk about making a mountain out a mole hill. I refuse to be "baited" to your accusations. I'm done with this thread. Colleen Donnelly Steve Grainger <hckryhillgsd@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: Why are you on a conformation show List, you obviously have some disdain for conformation showing? Even at the all-breed shows dogs are baited to show animation..it may be acceptable..but it is still a form of enhancing the dogs performance. Why do people train with treats? Have you not heard of positive reinforcement training?. I have known obedience exhibitors to carry treats in their pockets while in the ring so that the dog anticipates the reward at the end of the performance.I have seen some rub the treats on their hands so the dog anticipates getting the reward. Bait is a no-no is not allowed in the obedience ring but they "break the rules" and do it anyhow. I have seen obedience exhibitors train their dogs on the show site..this is a big no-no,too..but they used to sneak and do it anyhow now many just do it openly..seems they have no problem "breaking the rules". I am certain if you get out enough and observe both venues of performance you will see people "breaking the rules."C.Grainger > [Original Message] > From: Colleen Donnelly > To: ; > Date: 5/15/2005 5:35:19 PM > Subject: [ SHOWGSD-L ] Re: Double handling > > So in essence you are saying the rules can be broken so why not. Well then why the he** are there even rules there? > > Why would you assume everyone would be "lumbering" around? The dogs that are *happy* to show would still strut their stuff! Maybe a change would need to be made to ring size or shape or something? > > Your theory about speeding up if everyone else around you is speeding is scary. That requires absolutely no thought. Isn't that like being a sheep instead of the herder? > > Colleen > > > > > > > Double handling is part of dog shows today. It may be against AKC rules, but > then if the AKC were serious enough, the practice would be easy for them to > stop by making the rule a strict one with always enforced hard penalties. In > Germany, doubling is part of the game. In England, it is apparently banned. > Somewhere in between we have AKC shows. I suppose we could all dress up in our > Sunday best and silently watch our dogs lumbering around the ring until the > judge politely points to one or the other? I prefer a little excitement though > ... and doubling can actually become a side competition in itself. > > My theory is simple. If I'm driving the speed limit and everyone is passing > me, I speed up. It's either that or get run over eventually. > > Tom Langlitz > > > ============================================================================ > POST is Copyrighted 2005. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. > > ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. > > For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx > > VISIT OUR WEBSITE - http://www.showgsd.org > ============================================================================ > > > > > > GERMAN SHEPHERD DOG BREED BETTERMENT REGISTRY > > The only way to understand & estimate the nature of the dog is to study his whole development. Such a task requires a sympathetic, dog-loving observer, who tries as far as possible to enter into the innermost mind of the dog, and who will know how to short-circuit all his purely human points of view. --Max von Stephanitz > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Post your free ad now! Yahoo! Canada Personals > > > ============================================================================ > POST is Copyrighted 2005. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. > > ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. > > For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx > > VISIT OUR WEBSITE - http://www.showgsd.org > ============================================================================ ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2005. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - http://www.showgsd.org ============================================================================ GERMAN SHEPHERD DOG BREED BETTERMENT REGISTRY The only way to understand & estimate the nature of the dog is to study his whole development. Such a task requires a sympathetic, dog-loving observer, who tries as far as possible to enter into the innermost mind of the dog, and who will know how to short-circuit all his purely human points of view. --Max von Stephanitz --------------------------------- Post your free ad now! Yahoo! Canada Personals ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2005. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - http://www.showgsd.org ============================================================================