I responded in private about this and seeing your 2 posts has me feeling I should share! Paulette mentions a bitch who "killed" both of her litters. Ruth mentions one who only killed one but was fine bred at a later age. #1 Ruth's note shows me it was really more of a - not knowing and/or accidental mess. #2 Paulette didn't say how the bitch she knew did the deed. The one I knew (had her for her FOURTH litter) I'd not been told of all the mess she'd had before by anyone - 3 different folks for the 3 different litters. When I had her, she'd had 2 pups, all fine a little earlier whelping than I'd figured, had her in box etc., but wasn't right on top that AM. I left to get what I usually have for whelping actions. When I came back, not long, maybe about 20 mins or so -- she'd had another puppy and she just looked at me and turned and grabbed each one and crushed the life out of each one so fast I was totally shocked. It was purposful like I've seen when a dog will kill a rat, no blood, just a crushing bite!! In this present case, even the household situation there doesn't seem good for such. I also mentioned, as a Breeder I never bred unless I had at least 2 orders for pups. My advice is to NOT breed the dog at all. JMHO Norma no L ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ruth Scheubler" <rightdogphoto@xxxxxxxxx> To: <cnnpmm2@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>; "DaList" <showgsd-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2008 6:11 PM Subject: [ SHOWGSD-L ] Re: Breeding Question I know a bitch who killed her first litter (stomping on two while cleaning one, carryig one, turning around and slamming it against the wall while looking at the other pups). She became a fabulous mother with the next litter. She was slow to mature and just needed some experiences. Ruth cnnpmm2@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx wrote: Regarding breeding a bitch who killed her litter... I knew of a bitch who killed her first litter. She was bred two seasons later, and killed her whelps once again. This bitch didn't appear to have any psychological problems other than the fact she killed the two litters. The bitch was never bred again. Personally, I would tell the couple to spay their bitch. Paulette McGuirt, GSDCA Member Qui Me Amat, Amat et Canem Meam ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2007. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - www.showgsd.org ============================================================================ ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2007. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - www.showgsd.org ============================================================================