Good photos Beth. And.....a Bi Color with a gray undercoat is NOT a sable! A sable is pretty obvious, as is a bi color. A bi color is just that. A dog with TWO colors and no shadings or blending of other colors. Carolyn marhaven@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx www.marhaven.com From: showgsd-l-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:showgsd-l-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Beth Andrews Sent: Wednesday, January 21, 2015 5:43 AM To: cnnpmm2@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx; proudk911@xxxxxxxxx; SHOW LIST Subject: [ SHOWGSD-L ] Re: Black & Red and Black Sables... These are Black Sables On Tuesday, January 20, 2015 10:11 PM, "cnnpmm2@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx" <cnnpmm2@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: Jen writes: "Jen P & her Pack laughing about the semantics knowing that what I register as "tan", most of y'all would consider "red" (my reasoning being that I don't think it is red when you compare to what internationally is considered red..." Hmmm... I'd love to see one of your dogs that you say you registered as tan which most of us would consider red. Have you imported or bred European black&red dogs? Do you attend many SV shows? Just curious because when I went to your website, all I saw were whites. BTW, "most of y'all" is quite the hasty generalization. Paulette McGuirt Wellborn-Allemande GSDs On 1/21/2015 12:20 AM, Jen Proud wrote: it appears that what people think "is" a certain color or pattern is a matter of either opinion or semantics. So it leaves me wondering, hearing the talk about "black" sables. For those willing to answer, how would you describe the look of a black sable? Or now that we can post pictures, a picture would work great too! Just throwing it out there, thinking along the lines of how we can become more effective in promoting our breed and all about it in a consistent manner all around the nation, and the positive effect that would have for the breed if we were unified in our terminology at least Jen P & her Pack laughing about the semantics knowing that what I register as "tan", most of y'all would consider "red" (my reasoning being that I don't think it is red when you compare to what internationally is considered red... We'd almost call it "mahogany" here in America!) oh and to me, a "black" sable is one who looks just like a bicolor until you part their hair to reveal the undercoat being phaeomelanic instead of eumelanic -- JayDee's Proud-Haus Shepherds/Proud K911 Canine Consulting Committed to the Total Dog you can be Proud of!!! www.jaydeesphs.com <http://www.jaydeesphs.com/> Support the next generation's stewards in the sport of dogs... Donate to the German Shepherd Dog Youth Recognition Fund! www.dogshowjuniors.com <http://www.dogshowjuniors.com/> ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2015. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of both the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. Each Author is responsible for the content of his/her post. This group and its administrators are not responsible for the comments or opinions expressed in any post. POSTS CANNOT BE USED IN A COURT OF LAW. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - http://showgsd.org SUBSCRIPTION: http://showgsd.org/mail.html NATIONAL BLOG - http://gsdnational.blogspot.com/ ============================================================================