I have been using the turtle for the last 3 litters. It works great.. You have to start young 4 wks. Also put it in a deep enough bucket, the pups can't take it out. They will if they can see it. If they do, it is not harmful. I have had it happen It is not a cure, it is a preventative that works. The turtle is placed in the drinking bucket, and lasts about 10 days. I use 2 to 3 turtles a litter. They run about $3.00 each. No cocci...... You can buy them at Pet Smart in the Reptile/turtle section. Also catalogs that carry reptile/turtle supplies. I have ordered it on line from Pet Smart, but now I have one down the St.... Susie _www.geocities.com/witmergsd_ (http://www.geocities.com/witmergsd) ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2004. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - http://www.showgsd.org ============================================================================