At 04:05 PM 1/2/06 -0800, Peter K. wrote: >Yes, I understand what you are saying. But that brings up a question then. >If what you say is true, and let's say Nikon goes bankrupt, do the other >companies bail them out? In 1991, Daimler-Benz advised Mercedes they were on their own: that is, they either had to break even or shut down, a similar position to that handed down to Zeiss Ikon in early 1972 by the Zeiss Foundation. Similarly, at around that same time, Mitsubishi told Nikon the same thing. Nikon pulled out, barely, though it is still not a great market-leader for the Mitsubishi Vertical Monopoly. Had Nikon not been able to break even or better, Mitsubishi would have let them go under. In other words, Mitsubishi was no longer going to pay their tab. The situation is similar but not identical with Canon, which is more tightly integrated, with the Canon Camera dudes being an integral part of the Canon concern -- Canon, having broken off from Mitsubishi in the later 1940's is exempt from a lot of the antitrust matters which afflict Mitsubishi. Canon makes its raw money out of sales for digital and optical systems for office and industrial machines, and this is a real cash cow. Canon hasn't made a loss in a lot of years but it could afford to do so for quite a while before the overall Canon concern would become worried. Mitsubishi is far larger than is Canon, but their profit margin is much smaller, so they have to pay close attention to their P&L statement. Zeiss made its money from the later 1800's into the 1990's from scientific, medical, industrial, and military optics. Sports optics and cameras were a side-show maintained for the glamor effect. By the late 1950's, the only thing bringing money into Zeiss Ikon were the point-'n'-shoot Contessas and the Contaflex SLR's, and the burden of the Contarex simply swamped their balance sheet. The Zeiss Foundation pulled the plug twelve years or so after the introduction of the Contarex and the timing was controlled by the retirement of the head of Zeiss, Heinz Küppenbender, who had started out as the Head of Contax back after the Nazis ran off the fellow who conceived of the camera system. The Zeiss Sports Optics wasn't at risk as they always break even or better, as is also the case with Leica Sports Optics: there is ALWAYS a market for quality spotting scopes and binoculars, and, yes, I am awash in Zeiss glasses and own a Leitz APO-Televid with a full set of oculars, and a grand scope it is. (Nikon and Pentax have found the same to be true: Nikon specializes in mid-quality sport optics, while Pentax makes some gear directly competitive with the products of Leica and Zeiss and, of course, at the same price-point.) In the 1990's, that "peace dividend" brought about by the end of the Cold War damned Zeiss, as military contracts dried up, especially for such really fancy items as integrated radar/optical gunsights and submarine periscopes. And Zeiss' hap-handedness at getting into night vision only made the red ink bleed all over the place. This was when Zeiss got its lensworks into hawking lenses for digital p&s cameras, with salvation for the concern -- Zeiss sold as many lenses to Sony between 1996 and 2004 for use on its digital cameras as all versions of Zeiss had produced between 1846 and 1996. Now, Zeiss is back in the military end of things and seems to have gotten night vision under control; some friends of mine at the ITT Night Vision labs across town grumble about Zeiss, but, finally, Zeiss managed to beat ITT out of some hefty contracts in recent years, so they seem to be doing something right. Marc msmall@xxxxxxxxxxxx Cha robh bàs fir gun ghràs fir! NEW FAX NUMBER: +540-343-8505 --- Rollei List - Post to rollei_list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx - Subscribe at rollei_list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'subscribe' in the subject field OR by logging into www.freelists.org - Unsubscribe at rollei_list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'unsubscribe' in the subject field OR by logging into www.freelists.org - Online, searchable archives are available at //www.freelists.org/archives/rollei_list