Al, Now when Marc chimes in, this discussion will become interesting! Jerry Allen Zak wrote: > On Sep 29, 2005, at 1:43 PM, John Jensen wrote: > > > You have an interesting history of experiences with > > communism. Now, to provoke some controversy here, I > > will repeat a good line - "Communism is nothing but > > Liberalism in a hurry." > > Provocation accepted. > > That formulation assumes that "Communism" and "Liberalism" are part of > the same political/economic continuum. However, the various iterations > of socialism have nothing to do with "liberalism," which is part of a > capitalist ideological arc that includes "conservatism." Both isms > support private accumulation while socialism does not. > > Grossly simplified, conservatism consists of: "Grab all you can and > smash anyone who gets in the way." Liberalism is more like "Grab all > you can and throw a few coins at the rabble to buy some social peace." > The institutions of state welfare sometimes resemble socialism but are > usually established for other reasons. For example, Europe's first > social security system, advocated by Karl Marx, was launched by Otto > von Bismark, who was neither liberal nor socialist. > > I hope this helps. > > Allen Zak > > > > > --- > Rollei List > > - Post to rollei_list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > > - Subscribe at rollei_list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'subscribe' > in the subject field OR by logging into www.freelists.org > > - Unsubscribe at rollei_list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with > 'unsubscribe' in the subject field OR by logging into www.freelists.org > > - Online, searchable archives are available at > //www.freelists.org/archives/rollei_list --- Rollei List - Post to rollei_list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx - Subscribe at rollei_list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'subscribe' in the subject field OR by logging into www.freelists.org - Unsubscribe at rollei_list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'unsubscribe' in the subject field OR by logging into www.freelists.org - Online, searchable archives are available at //www.freelists.org/archives/rollei_list