[rollei_list] Re: AW: Re: Rollei Insolvency...

  • From: Marcus Kaufhold <kaufhold@xxxxxxxxx>
  • To: rollei_list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
  • Date: Thu, 23 Apr 2015 21:47:15 +0200

Very interesting!

Maybe a few of the former workers are looking for the "After-Market".

The same thing is on with General Aviation Aircrafts:
http://www.sportys.com/172LITE

Marcus

Am 23.04.2015 um 20:57 schrieb Dirk-Roger.Schmitt@xxxxxx:


Let's see.

What is with the stock of made Hy6 and TLRs and lenses at the factory?

They were not on sale on the insolvency auction.

Second, rumors say, that some workers plan to continue something.

Honestly to say, I watched that nearly all tooling and measuring and testing equipment was sold.

But, maybe there is one secret part left.

Let's be surprised.

Dirk


Dirk-Roger Schmitt


*Von:*rollei_list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:rollei_list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] *Im Auftrag von *Eric Goldstein
*Gesendet:* Donnerstag, 23. April 2015 20:09
*An:* rollei_list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
*Betreff:* [rollei_list] Re: Rollei Insolvency...

Hi Tom -

I know we love our Rolleis, but let's be frank... there is absolutely nothing about a TLR body that would preclude it from being manufactured with great precision in China. Tolerance and materials handling well within what is routinely done there.

Complex lens production is another matter but that takes place in specialized facilities anyway and always has.

I know of custom tooling, robotics and instrumentation being done very very well in Chinese facilities.

Eric Goldstein

On Thu, Apr 23, 2015 at 2:00 PM, tom rogers <jtomrogers@xxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:jtomrogers@xxxxxxxxxxx>> wrote:

Eric;

Point taken - much of the poor quality product coming out of China is built to a price-point, not quality absolutes:
However, let's be frank - you can specify tolerances all you want, but unless there is on-site Q.C., with random inspections, and a culture of excellence, contractors will cut corners to shave costs; as many companies have discovered dealing with Chinese suppliers.

I would argue that, as you say - "highly specialized production with highly specialized tooling and assembly requirements," definitely includes a Rolleiflex TLR or Leica M:
So what businesses do you know, and what are their products? I'm not aware of Leica or Manley equivalent examples sourced from China - not yet, anyway.

There was one Chinese microphone company manufacturing for a number of 3rd party brands; they were building to a price point, and acknowledged the product (and their workforce's) shortcomings - but they had a longterm plan to gradually improve their in-house tech and manu, with a goal to eventually producing Neuman or Brauner quality condenser mics under their own brand: Not sure how that panned out.

"...There is nothing exceptionally demanding about producing pro audio gear ..."

The term "pro audio" gets thrown around a lot to describe product that really isn't:
In my experience, producing truly pro audio gear - the handmade kind with very tight electronic and mechanical tolerance - is exceptionally demanding;
which is why so few people do it. Like anything handbuilt, it costs.


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From: egoldste@xxxxxxxxx <mailto:egoldste@xxxxxxxxx>
Date: Thu, 23 Apr 2015 13:13:57 -0400


Subject: [rollei_list] Re: Rollei Insolvency...
To: rollei_list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:rollei_list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>

You are confusing capability with specifications.

If a manufacturer specifies production with a certain level of quality, high tolerances and low failure rates, AND PAYS FOR IT, many chinese manufacturing facilities are capable of producing with high precision, about as high as you can find anywhere. This unless you are talking about highly specialized production with highly specialized tooling and assembly requirements; then it depends on the category.

If they do not specify it and pay for it, then they do not get it.

I know several businesses who use china for their high quality production and have been very please with what they get year after year.

There is nothing exceptionally demanding about producing pro audio gear and I have no doubt that it can be done in China or most of Asia given that what I just detailed is in play...

Eric Goldstein

On Thu, Apr 23, 2015 at 1:04 PM, tom rogers <jtomrogers@xxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:jtomrogers@xxxxxxxxxxx>> wrote:

Smartphones are not handmade precision instruments assembled one at a time by highly trained and skilled workers carrying on a centuries old tradition.
They are mass-produced on assembly lines staffed by 20-something peasants in China.
The Seagull is a piece of junk.
The Rollei Singapore factory Q.C. was hit and miss.
Outside of Japan and Germany, few other countries have a historical knowledgebase needed to manufacture something like a manual film TLR.

I work in the pro audio field - Chinese made equipment is junk.
The microphones are notorious for their poor tolerances, finish, and sound quality; but they look just like a $4000 German made mic, and are dirt cheap.



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From: dsadowski@xxxxxxxxx <mailto:dsadowski@xxxxxxxxx>
Date: Thu, 23 Apr 2015 08:06:40 -0500
Subject: [rollei_list] Re: Rollei Insolvency...
To: rollei_list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:rollei_list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>

We live in an age where quality products can be made anywhere, China included. We have come a long way from the time 30 years ago when I purchased a Pearl River TLR and discovered that it was junk.

Nowadays, there is quite a lot of interest in classic cameras in Hong Kong, China and other places in the Far East. I discovered that recently when I sold a few things.

This was an area where Rollei was ahead of their time with their Singapore plant. I got a Singapore-made 35SE brand new and found the quality to be excellent.

Nowadays probably half the people in the US are walking around with a smart phone made in China and the quality of these items is excellent.

On Thu, Apr 23, 2015 at 7:55 AM, Brett Rogers <rogersbretta@xxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:rogersbretta@xxxxxxxxxxx>> wrote:

Personally I would rather see the Rollei TLRs end forever, than have production moved to China and be tainted by an association with the quality many of that country's products, rightly or wrongly, have become well-known for.

> Date: Tue, 21 Apr 2015 15:57:16 -0400
> From: jdecher@xxxxxxx <mailto:jdecher@xxxxxxx>
> To: rollei_list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:rollei_list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Subject: [rollei_list] Rollei Insolvency...


>
> Very sad news indeed. I was also hoping there would at least be some
> solid Chinese bid for the whole lot, which would then be put
> dismantled and put back together in China.
> This thing purportedly happened with whole steel works when they
> closed in my home region (Westphalia) 25 years ago.
>
> Too bad I did not make it to Braunschweig to visit the factory before
> this happened...
>
> Jan
> (shot my SL66 this evening in brilliant sunlight)
>
>
> > 2015-04-20 17:09 GMT-03:00 <Dirk-Roger.Schmitt@xxxxxx <mailto:Dirk-Roger.Schmitt@xxxxxx>>:
> >> Unfortunately,
> >>
> >> I have very bad news.
> >>
> >> The Insolvency Sale starts on Tuesday.
> >>
> >> I hoped, there would be somebody found who would take all items in a batch
> >> to continue, but this did not happen.
> >>
> >> I take numerous of photos which I will display later on.
> >> ...........................
> >> Best regards, and God bless some people from former DHW which still want
> >> to continue.
> >
> >> Regards
> >>
> >> Dirk
> >>
> >> Dirk-Roger Schmitt
>
>
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