[project1dev] Re: multiplayer

  • From: Matthew Morgan <MMorgan@xxxxxxxxxx>
  • To: "project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx" <project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Fri, 8 May 2009 10:38:30 -0700

So we're all on the same page?


From: project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
[mailto:project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Alan Wolfe
Sent: Friday, May 08, 2009 10:37 AM
To: project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [project1dev] Re: multiplayer

neato... after i made this post yesterday, wurmz was talkign to me on aim about 
it and thats what he came to the conclusion of too :P

seems like it makes most sense - it deffinately does from a tech POV (makes me 
happy inside hehe)
On Fri, May 8, 2009 at 10:25 AM, Matthew Morgan 
<MMorgan@xxxxxxxxxx<mailto:MMorgan@xxxxxxxxxx>> wrote:

I think we should stick with saucer only on this one.



Do you mean the SNES Zelda? Coz that one's the business.





From: project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> 
[mailto:project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>]
 On Behalf Of figarus@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:figarus@xxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Friday, May 08, 2009 10:23 AM

To: project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [project1dev] Re: multiplayer



I think if we make the action rpg zelda style game in the future that would 
work better multiplayer... I don't know of any ff style rpgs with the 
multiplayer that we are thinking - unfortunately, we can't have it all, as much 
as I'd love to. We will run into this occasionally and sacrifices have to be 
made... So the question is, I think kent is right, we either need to go balls 
to the wall multiplayer or just stick with the golden saucer multiplayer, cuz 
if we half ass it, it will be a waste of time/energy...

I am just not sure. I love multiplayer and envision adventuring with a 
friend/friends and it being totally epic and fun but on the other hand, to 
really embrace multiplayer, single player will suffer and I really think the 
majority of people would play single player the majority of the time. Its hard 
enough to organize my homies to play left4dead on xbox for a couple hours, let 
alone the 40+ hours to go through an rpg.

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________________________________

From: Matthew Morgan
Date: Fri, 8 May 2009 10:09:50 -0700
To: 
project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx><project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>>
Subject: [project1dev] Re: multiplayer

Perhaps this project should just be single player except for the saucer idea, 
and on the next one we can all be more multiplayer-minded?





From: project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> 
[mailto:project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>]
 On Behalf Of Kent Petersen
Sent: Friday, May 08, 2009 10:05 AM
To: project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [project1dev] Re: multiplayer



Forcing players to split up is a good idea too. That way it's like 2 separate 
single player levels. In single player the player could choose either path. 
It's a good way to avoid having to test things for both single and multiplayer 
because it would really only be 2 separate single player paths. There are 
numerous other ways to keep simple multi playered levels as well, such as a 
simple switch that requires a player to stand on. You could have a door with 
trapped enemies inside. One player stands on the switch to open the door where. 
The second player then battles hsi way into this room single handedly. If the 
battleing player becomes too wounded he can leave the battle room and swap 
places with the 1st player. So now you have one fresh player battling and the 
wounded player recovering on the switch. That type of scenario would be 
relativly simple to make and require 2 players.

I guess there would be an increase in content. There probably wouldn't be 
double the content but there would definately be an increase. It would also get 
very difficult to manage once the levels became larger and more complicated.

I think having full on multiplayer could create an amazing experience. I think 
it would take a lot of careful planning to truly make it shine. On that same 
thought, if multiplayer was half assed and not as polished as I imagine, the 
game would be terrible no matter how great all of the other aspects are. 
Especially since we would be designing the game from the ground up with that 
feature in mind. If we do decide to change our minds it would be difficult.

What does everyone else think?

On Fri, May 8, 2009 at 9:29 AM, Alan Wolfe 
<alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx>> wrote:

#1 and #3 make sense (:

For #2 would you want to build and script twice as much stuff... one for single 
player and one for multiplayer?  And then you'd have to test both to make sure 
they work ok and that there wasn't a typo (like an extra 0 added onto how much 
rep you get for completing the multiplayer quest vs the single).

Duplicated effort tends to have a lot of bugs in it because of human error 
(thats why people make functions instead of copy / pasting code).

Seems like we'd introduce a lot of bugs and have to do double the work going 
that way, but it is a pretty good idea as a solution to the problem.  Like for 
instance maybe we could only have 2 versions where it mattered.  So for most of 
the game it's all the same stuff but in caves where there are puzzles etc they 
change whether you are single or multiplayer.  I'd still be weary about the 
extra bugs it would for sure create.

From a technical standpoint i really agree w/ you on the last point, i like the 
idea of limited / specialized multiplayer (:



On Fri, May 8, 2009 at 8:40 AM, Kent Petersen 
<kentkmp@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:kentkmp@xxxxxxxxx>> wrote:

Oh, fun questions.

1a) I assumed people would get thrown into the fight together. Either person 
triggers a fight both players go in.
1b) If you wanted it to be a little more interesting you could have it where 
the players need the enage the enemies individually. After the player touches a 
monster there is a small delay before entering the battle to give the 2nd 
player a chance to get into the fight. The second player can choose to not 
fight at all or fight something different. Battles could play out in more of a 
real time. Potentially you could even have monster or players join the battle 
once it's going.

2) dungeon design wouldnt be too bad. I would say you would make 2 paths. 1 for 
single player and one for multiplayer. You could have them have different 
items. The single player path could have things break once you pass making it a 
one person way. The multiplayer paths could have puzzles that require 2 ppl.

3a) I assumed that the players will just drag eachother. If one player enters a 
new room the second player will teleport there.
3b)You could also do it toe jam and earl style (original on the genesis) where 
the players are just allowed to seperate. This would go well with the combat 
idea.

With all that said I feel it is unnessasry. Maybe a colliseum could be cool to 
battle your friends and to compare equipment. Maybe there could be an online 
FF7 Golden Saucer where everyone can meet gamble, show off gear, whatever.



On Fri, May 8, 2009 at 8:18 AM, Alan Wolfe 
<alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx>> wrote:

ok so you guys are saying ""yeah multiplayer!!!" but lets talk details.

So how would it work?

lets ignore technical concerns and talk game design...


#1) how would combat work... if you are walking around and your buddy is too, 
and he gets into a fight, do you automatically get tossed into that fight to?  
what happens?

#2) if we allow multiplayer, we'd have to design all caves and dungeons to work 
with multiplayer.  What i mean is we couldn't have any puzzles or things which 
were designed for single player.  IE if you have something like you have to 
push a boulder from upstairs into a pit, it falls downstairs, you roll it onto 
the switch and you can get into another room, we can't do that cause in 
multiplayer, the 2nd player could just stand on the switch and let you through 
etc.

#3) what happens when your buddy enters a different room while you are walking 
around in the 1st room or like exploring it... do you get teleported into the 
other room automatically?



On Fri, May 8, 2009 at 7:38 AM, Matthew Morgan 
<MMorgan@xxxxxxxxxx<mailto:MMorgan@xxxxxxxxxx>> wrote:

Yep yep. 6-3, trying to get it switched to 5:30-2:00=-D





From: project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> 
[mailto:project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>]On
 Behalf Of figarus@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:figarus@xxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Friday, May 08, 2009 7:37 AM

To: project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [project1dev] Re: multiplayer



What time do you get in, 6am?

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________________________________

From: Matthew Morgan
Date: Fri, 8 May 2009 07:36:24 -0700
To: 
project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx><project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>>
Subject: [project1dev] Re: multiplayer

Yah, and I do work pretty early....





From: project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> 
[mailto:project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>]On
 Behalf Of figarus@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:figarus@xxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Friday, May 08, 2009 7:32 AM
To: project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [project1dev] Re: multiplayer



Lol...... He has a weird schedule like 10 - 7 or something

Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile

________________________________

From: Matthew Morgan
Date: Fri, 8 May 2009 07:30:24 -0700
To: 
project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx><project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>>
Subject: [project1dev] Re: multiplayer

Maybe if he'd get up and get to work like us!





From: project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> 
[mailto:project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>]On
 Behalf Of eric drewes
Sent: Friday, May 08, 2009 7:27 AM
To: project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [project1dev] Re: multiplayer



yeah, we'll have to talk to alan about this stuff cuz it could almost be a game 
in and of itself

On Fri, May 8, 2009 at 10:26 AM, Matthew Morgan 
<MMorgan@xxxxxxxxxx<mailto:MMorgan@xxxxxxxxxx>> wrote:

I like the gauntlet or Man vs Beast w/one weapon, adds a little flavor to it, 
maybe there could be different parts of the arena for different things, a 
gambling hall, a gladiator hall(full on battles), a bestiary (battling beasts 
w/one weapon), wrestling ring (diff weight classes) all with diff. challenges 
or things to do.





From: project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> 
[mailto:project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>]On
 Behalf Of Chris Sherman
Sent: Friday, May 08, 2009 7:23 AM

To: project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [project1dev] Re: multiplayer



I love the arena/tournament idea but I've never seen anybody really take it 
where I think it could go. For instance having a heavyweight and lightweight 
battle class would be cool, betting could be done in increments and instead of 
just getting your pool back plus house money you would get other players money. 
I also like the thought of having different challenges like a gauntlet or a man 
vs beasts where man is equipped with only one weapon and no armor... Feel free 
to expand on it if you wish :)

Sent from my BlackBerry

________________________________

From: figarus@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:figarus@xxxxxxxxx>
Date: Fri, 8 May 2009 14:17:57 +0000
To: <project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>>
Subject: [project1dev] Re: multiplayer

quick things...

I agree co-op would be fun but my only concern is, it will take away some 
resources that could be used in other places that may be better bang for the 
buck...

Alan iis gathering ideas for making how multiplayer would potentially work so 
maybe he has yet another rabbit to pull out of his hat :)

Re: arena...

Definitely one of the things I am really into for this game is a battle arena 
wheer you can fight, or gamble on monsters fighting :) something to definitely 
thing about if anyone has any ideas

Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile

________________________________

From: Matthew Morgan
Date: Fri, 8 May 2009 07:08:24 -0700
To: 
project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx><project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>>
Subject: [project1dev] Re: multiplayer

I definitely think being able to hook up with your friends and playing would 
make the game way better... everythings better with buddies.



How would it work though, you would just have your heros? Or would it be the 
guy who set it ups party and you can control one of his guys?



I like the idea of arenas. Kind of like the Coliseum in FF3 or something where 
you could join in and battle people perhaps for unique-ish items or something. 
Just an idea...









From: project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> 
[mailto:project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>]On
 Behalf Of figarus@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:figarus@xxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Friday, May 08, 2009 6:59 AM
To: project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [project1dev] Re: multiplayer



Alan and I talked about maybe at least having an arena where you can fight 
other ppl... I defer to him when it comes to multiplayer cuz he knows how hard 
it will be and will be the one putting code in...

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________________________________

From: "Chris Sherman"
Date: Fri, 8 May 2009 13:53:44 +0000
To: <project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>>
Subject: [project1dev] Re: multiplayer

What if we did it small scale multiplayer like you could be on a server or 
virtual lan with buddies or a few random people and if you wanted to join their 
party you could but you wouldn't have to. Ie test drive unlimiteds approach to 
mmo

Sent from my BlackBerry

________________________________

From: Matthew Morgan
Date: Fri, 8 May 2009 06:49:38 -0700
To: 
project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx><project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>>
Subject: [project1dev] Re: multiplayer

Multiplayer IS bonus. But it would maybe get difficult is other people had 
wanted to go different directions in dungeons/caves and what not, and some 
people like grinding and some people want to just get through it, so maybe MP 
wouldn't be good in this case... I dunno.









From: project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> 
[mailto:project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>]On
 Behalf Of Chris Sherman
Sent: Friday, May 08, 2009 6:31 AM
To: project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [project1dev] Re: multiplayer



Multiplayer is awesome, TOTALY AWESOME!

Sent from my BlackBerry

________________________________

From: figarus@xxxxxxxxx<mailto:figarus@xxxxxxxxx>
Date: Fri, 8 May 2009 13:17:27 +0000
To: <project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>>
Subject: [project1dev] Re: multiplayer

I guess the question is... Do you guys think ppl would be interested in playing 
multiplayer? FF6 had it but I never used it. I love co-op and playing w/ 
friends but I don't know if itd work with a story driven rpg...

Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile

________________________________

From: Matthew Morgan
Date: Fri, 8 May 2009 06:11:53 -0700
To: 
project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx><project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>>
Subject: [project1dev] Re: multiplayer

I think that would be perfect=-P



Keeping them together like gauntlet lengends kinda but switch screens for 
battle...





From: project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> 
[mailto:project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>]On
 Behalf Of Alan Wolfe
Sent: Thursday, May 07, 2009 8:05 PM
To: project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [project1dev] multiplayer



Hey so before we started makin this game, Eric was saying it would be really 
neat if we could support multiplayer.

We've talked a little bit about it randomly (like the possibility of being able 
to play mini games against other people online or other stuff...) but it's been 
kind of hard figuring out how FULL ON multiplayer would work in our game.  A 
big part of the hurdle for me has been figuring out how to do the combat in 
multiplayer (since it goes to a seperate screen... would the other player go 
into that screen too or...?)

Anyhow, I personally can't figure out a good way but I wanted to open it up to 
everyone else before we said "bah forget it"

Eric has had some ideas about this such as the players having to stay within a 
screen length of eachother, and when one person goes into combat they both go 
into combat and control their own characters.

What do you guys think... can multiplayer work for a game like ours?



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