[project1dev] Re: game narrative structure

  • From: Nick Klotz <roracsenshi@xxxxxxxxx>
  • To: project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
  • Date: Sun, 17 May 2009 16:37:40 -0500

I like how Dragon Warrior/Quest 4 does it.

But being less linear.


On Sun, May 17, 2009 at 2:54 PM, Kent Petersen <kentkmp@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> Ah, I think I get what you mean. So these smaller self contained stories
> will be like the split story in FF3 or like the acts in Diablo 2. Where it
> would be a "full game" with a beginning middle and end with its own
> characters and everything. Upon completing one, you will be able to return
> to it and replay it. Upon completing the entire game you will unlock a new
> mode that takes place 15 years later but the entire world is accessible from
> the start, more like Zelda where you can wander around anywhere. Am I right?
>
> When you return to an already beaten world will you be able to use any
> characters? Could I use characters I didn't get from that world? If you
> return to a world does the story start over or do you return after it
> happened more Fallout 2 after you beat the game
>
> Do all the worlds have to be played in order like Diablo 2 or will you get
> to choose like in FF3?
>
>
> On Sun, May 17, 2009 at 10:52 AM, eric drewes <figarus@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
>> right, and the short stories would all be self-contained also so there
>> would be a definitive beginning, middle and end.  so there'd be story arcs
>> in the chapter and then an overall arc telling the whole story.  the
>> free-mode would be the aftermath
>>
>>
>> On Sun, May 17, 2009 at 1:19 PM, Chris Riccobono <crysalim@xxxxxxxxx>wrote:
>>
>>> As I understand it, we could basically create levels, and then form a
>>> story around them, and those would tie into a plot altogether.  Am I
>>> correct?
>>>
>>> Also, I like the episodic nature of release idea.  This will let us
>>> concentrate on entire areas as milestones, and help bring our work
>>> together in a more cohesive fashion.
>>>
>>> On Sun, May 17, 2009 at 9:58 AM, eric drewes <figarus@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>> > ok, im thinking about it like this... each chapter is like its own self
>>> > contained story where you play through it... think of like an expanded
>>> > version of the scenes in ff3 like where Locke has to go to east figaro
>>> and
>>> > delay the soldiers long enough, etc. etc. and he ends up finding celes
>>> and
>>> > rescuing her and has to go in disguise and stuff... like that would be
>>> a
>>> > "chapter" but ours would be longer with a bigger story arc.  there'd be
>>> like
>>> > 5-6 (maybe more, we'd know when we got into them, maybe instead of 5-6
>>> long
>>> > ones we could have a ton of short ones, like the opera scene in ff3
>>> could be
>>> > an example).  once you beat all the chapters, you would unlock freemode
>>> > which gives you free reign to explore the entire world and find
>>> adventures
>>> > like in the second half of ff3.
>>> >
>>> > Three key notes to this would be:
>>> >
>>> > you take your hero and recruited party into the chapters and you could
>>> > replay them (with characters/items that are found IN the chapter not
>>> able to
>>> > be brought in).  this would be cool cuz there's things like the opera
>>> scene
>>> > or the scene where you are sabin/cyan and recruit shadow and go through
>>> the
>>> > enemy camp and then the ghost train that i'd save before hand so i
>>> could
>>> > replay them.  also i picture we could have SOME randomized treasure ala
>>> > diablo 2 so people could make "runs" this would be a way for people to
>>> grind
>>> > also.  we'd balance it basically by making the levels progressively
>>> more
>>> > challenging and also i view the DIFFICULTY of the game being set where
>>> > simply leveling won't be enough to destroy levels, even capped out
>>> you'd
>>> > have to be smart and savvy and strategize properly to survive.
>>> >
>>> > the second thing would be that once you finished the chapters you'd
>>> unlock
>>> > freemode which basically gives you the whole world to explore but it'd
>>> be
>>> > 10-15 years in the future (we'd explain it in the final story like you
>>> get
>>> > caught in the null realm and do battle there but when you come out its
>>> 15
>>> > years later) so the world has been changed drastically, monsters,
>>> treasure,
>>> > etc is different, we can have progression of things (like i had in mind
>>> a
>>> > scene where there was a war and an old man and the old man is like "war
>>> is
>>> > so terrible, this place is cursed by all the dead soldiers, i am going
>>> to
>>> > plant a tree for each one so they can find peace" and so when you
>>> revisit
>>> > the place it's a big forest.  children you encounter in the chapters
>>> could
>>> > be adults, etc.  we'd have a ton of mini stories and places to find and
>>> > explore in the "free mode"
>>> >
>>> > third thing is we could add more stories as mini-expansion packs and it
>>> > could be episodic in nature
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > On Sun, May 17, 2009 at 4:32 AM, Kent Petersen <kentkmp@xxxxxxxxx>
>>> wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >> For the sake of example lets say there are 3 zones. So you play
>>> through
>>> >> the 3 zones in order. After you beat the whole game you can then run
>>> through
>>> >> again on freemode where there would be more things to do but the same
>>> 3
>>> >> zones
>>> >>
>>> >> I'm not sure how I feel about it. I think I need more examples
>>> >>
>>> >> On Sat, May 16, 2009 at 11:02 PM, Matthew Freeland
>>> >> <mattthefiend@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Gonna... Be... EPIC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>>> >>>
>>> >>> On Sat, May 16, 2009 at 11:00 PM, <figarus@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> Ya, I actually have a storyline and town with the character/zombrero
>>> in
>>> >>>> mind for one of the chapters... I really like it and think he'll be
>>> an
>>> >>>> awesome recruitable guy with the guitar hero style attack. I even
>>> talked to
>>> >>>> a musician buddy of mine to write some horn/guitar style mariachi
>>> music in
>>> >>>> preparation :D
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> ________________________________
>>> >>>> From: Matthew Freeland
>>> >>>> Date: Sat, 16 May 2009 22:57:57 -0700
>>> >>>> To: <project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>> >>>> Subject: [project1dev] Re: game narrative structure
>>> >>>> There has to be some mystical guitar to rule the zombies with, so it
>>> can
>>> >>>> be like Guitar hero, only turn based combat RPG. Bwahahaa!!
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> On Sat, May 16, 2009 at 10:55 PM, <figarus@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> I will keep some of your ideas in mind... Definitely working the
>>> >>>>> zombrero storyline in... :P
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> ________________________________
>>> >>>>> From: Matthew Freeland
>>> >>>>> Date: Sat, 16 May 2009 22:39:43 -0700
>>> >>>>> To: <project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>> >>>>> Subject: [project1dev] Re: game narrative structure
>>> >>>>> Sounds fun to me.
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> Kinda curious as to how we should set up the entire world though...
>>> >>>>> I'll just roll with some simple questions to determine where we
>>> start and
>>> >>>>> how to arrange regions. You guys are free to give input at any
>>> time.
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> The character, who am I? Why am I here? Where am I going? Why am I
>>> >>>>> going there? (Where's buttercup?)
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> Let's say we're... a reservist soldier, male or female.
>>> Approximately
>>> >>>>> 21 or 22. Old enough to drink beer but not so young that your hair
>>> defies
>>> >>>>> gravity and you have a profoundly emo attitude like in a jRPG.
>>> You're in
>>> >>>>> your home country because you ARE. In a medium sized town big
>>> enough to have
>>> >>>>> the medieval equivalent of a Wal*Mart so there is plenty of stuff
>>> to do
>>> >>>>> around town to get familier with the concept of quest
>>> starting/execution.
>>> >>>>> You fiddle around in town for a long time doing quests, taking time
>>> to learn
>>> >>>>> all the basics of combat getting some levels and adapting to the
>>> game as a
>>> >>>>> whole. Some scary cave monster tried to jack your Zombrero and
>>> you're not
>>> >>>>> pleased about it and you decide for some unknown reason to track
>>> down the
>>> >>>>> scary cave monsters family to exact further vengeance upon them.
>>> Now you're
>>> >>>>> leaving region one which will still be accessible to you if you
>>> want to go
>>> >>>>> back (Preferably through a map screen, no need to fight through
>>> bunches of
>>> >>>>> weaker monsters to get back to earlier places).
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> You're in region 2 now. The story shifts from the learning mode
>>> into a
>>> >>>>> very mild challange as you progress and start to get slightly more
>>> difficult
>>> >>>>> monsters floating around. You quest along in the primary population
>>> center
>>> >>>>> of Region 2 and discover the whereabouts of the super scary cave
>>> monsters
>>> >>>>> super scary cave monster parents... either by questing and
>>> gathering
>>> >>>>> information or Deux ex Machina if you've played through the game
>>> already.
>>> >>>>> You hunt down the cave monster and beat the living crap out of it.
>>> While in
>>> >>>>> the cave and beating up the cave monster, a minor earthquake forces
>>> you to
>>> >>>>> flee a different direction than where you came in, as a path opens
>>> up during
>>> >>>>> the earthquake. You go through the path to find a pretty little
>>> isolated
>>> >>>>> grove in the mountains full of interesting and wonderful creatures
>>> and find
>>> >>>>> a house where some silly hermit person lives. Blah Blah Blah, quest
>>> this, go
>>> >>>>> here, That is Region 3. At this point it's assumed you understand
>>> the
>>> >>>>> mechanics of the game well enough that it won't hold your hand
>>> anymore.
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> Fastforward a whole lot of nonsense and all the sudden you've got
>>> some
>>> >>>>> real purpose to live, something that is important that your
>>> character do. If
>>> >>>>> nothing else because you're bored, who the hell knows.
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> After finally finding a purpose in life you go off and do all kinds
>>> of
>>> >>>>> fun adventuring things and end up finding lots of nifty companions
>>> with
>>> >>>>> nifty abilities and nifty personalities... then after progressing
>>> to this
>>> >>>>> point war breaks out between whole bunches of angry peoples and you
>>> want to
>>> >>>>> go home to your mommy. So you go home, and you get to protect it.
>>> Yay. Now
>>> >>>>> even though you're back home, everything is a whole lot stronger
>>> than it was
>>> >>>>> previously to match your increased strength. You get to defend your
>>> home and
>>> >>>>> then get back to your purpose in life.
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> Let's call this purpose some arbitrary gathering quest to collect
>>> the 8
>>> >>>>> magical stones of awesomeness. Now that the first few chapters are
>>> done with
>>> >>>>> and you've had ample opportunites to develop your backstory and
>>> that of your
>>> >>>>> buddies, the world gets alot bigger. Now you can rapidly travel
>>> between
>>> >>>>> locations on your continent. Let's say you get a nice little buggy
>>> like in
>>> >>>>> FF7 or a magical carpet or something which opens up the continent
>>> as a whole
>>> >>>>> to you, except maybe a few places for further exploration after you
>>> get
>>> >>>>> better transportation. You cruise around the continent on your
>>> quest for the
>>> >>>>> magical stones of awesome and find a couple on your continent as
>>> well you
>>> >>>>> have tons of nifty quests to do in all the different locations and
>>> lots of
>>> >>>>> monsters to brutalize. Pretty soon after this point you're going to
>>> need a
>>> >>>>> new ride, so you go rough up some wussy steampunk piratey people
>>> and steal
>>> >>>>> their steam powered boat of win to connect to other continents.
>>> Maybe even
>>> >>>>> back to their steam punky island of steampunk (perfect place for
>>> you to
>>> >>>>> design, Elizabeth).
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> Now you've gone from small region based exploration, to medium
>>> scale
>>> >>>>> continental exploration, to world exploration at which point the
>>> game is
>>> >>>>> completely open ended. We can even have little sections of the
>>> world that
>>> >>>>> have absolutely no relevence to the story whatsoever, but the story
>>> arc is
>>> >>>>> still important so if you want to you can continue on the storyline
>>> or go
>>> >>>>> exploring newly available continents. So you can go get super
>>> badass and
>>> >>>>> unstoppable and beat the boss at the end of the game who is
>>> horribly easy
>>> >>>>> *Cough, sephiroth, cough* but there are still tons of massive
>>> challenges
>>> >>>>> that await in the rest of the world, with smaller story arcs and
>>> questlines
>>> >>>>> that make you take on big nasty things and get lots of interesting
>>> stuff.
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> Then you grow old and die.
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> Weed through the sarcasm and bad grammer and see if that sounds
>>> >>>>> something like the narrative you had in mind.
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> I hope to avoid as many video game cliches as possible in this
>>> endeavor
>>> >>>>> but for the sake of arguement I had to use them as examples. :P
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> -Wurmz
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> On Sat, May 16, 2009 at 7:40 PM, <figarus@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>> >>>>>>
>>> >>>>>> What do you think about letting the chapters be replayable, like
>>> you
>>> >>>>>> have a character/party that you and you can re-enter any of the
>>> chapters or
>>> >>>>>> the freemode (once unlocked) like... Itd be less one long story
>>> and instead
>>> >>>>>> itd be like independant short that tied together with the same
>>> player...
>>> >>>>>> This is just an idea I was thinking.
>>> >>>>>>
>>> >>>>>> Oh and if we went this route the freemode would have a ton of
>>> content
>>> >>>>>> not in the stories...
>>> >>>>>>
>>> >>>>>> Just looking for feedback on the concept... It wouldn't affect
>>> this
>>> >>>>>> milestone or the next couple but (:
>>> >>>>>>
>>> >>>>>> Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile
>>> >>>>>>
>>> >>>>>> ________________________________
>>> >>>>>> From: Kent Petersen
>>> >>>>>> Date: Sat, 16 May 2009 18:37:29 -0700
>>> >>>>>> To: <project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>> >>>>>> Subject: [project1dev] Re: game narrative structure
>>> >>>>>> So basically you want to follow a FF3-esque story? First half very
>>> >>>>>> guided and teaches the player how to play. the second half would
>>> then be
>>> >>>>>> open and leaving it up to the player. I see this working well. We
>>> could have
>>> >>>>>> all the choices made in the first half of the game impact the
>>> second half
>>> >>>>>>
>>> >>>>>> On Sat, May 16, 2009 at 6:19 PM, eric drewes <figarus@xxxxxxxxx>
>>> >>>>>> wrote:
>>> >>>>>>>
>>> >>>>>>> just wanted to hear what you guys thought about this...
>>> >>>>>>> the idea is an evolution of the "world's" idea and also of the
>>> story
>>> >>>>>>> structure in diablo 2.
>>> >>>>>>> basically... the beginning of the game will be broken up into
>>> >>>>>>> "chapters" - linear storylines ala older final fantasy games
>>> where there is
>>> >>>>>>> a guided progression forward in the storylines, with a definitive
>>> beginning,
>>> >>>>>>> middle and climax.  There will be places to explore, etc but
>>> there is a
>>> >>>>>>> definite story arc for the player to experience.  once you finish
>>> the
>>> >>>>>>> chapter, you move on to the next one with a new area/theme.  once
>>> you beat
>>> >>>>>>> the chapters and the first half of the game, it unlocks
>>> "freemode" which is
>>> >>>>>>> like the world of ruin in ff3 where the entire world is open for
>>> you to
>>> >>>>>>> explore and you discover adventures and storylines in a very
>>> non-linear
>>> >>>>>>> unguided way. The second half of the game will likely be set a
>>> few years in
>>> >>>>>>> the future after the first part is defeated so that we can change
>>> the world
>>> >>>>>>> and add new monsters and caves and villains to fight and explore.
>>> >>>>>>> what do you guys think?
>>> >>>>>>
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>
>>> >>
>>> >
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>
>

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