[project1dev] Re: combat musings - injuries, status, party list, matchups and tagteaming

  • From: Alan Wolfe <alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx>
  • To: project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
  • Date: Thu, 30 Apr 2009 08:47:54 -0700

That sounds decent (:

On Thu, Apr 30, 2009 at 8:45 AM, eric drewes <figarus@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> well i think health would probably work like a hybrid of halo and marvel vs
> capcom where you have two health bars, current life and max life, your
> current life can go up via auto healing or first aid, but your max life
> cannot be restored unless you're in a town.
> example:
> main character has:
> max hp 100
> current hp 100
> he gets punched, losing life
> max hp 90
> current hp 70
> now he uses first aid, bringing him back up to 90 (100 is truemax, but he
> cannot attain that)
> max hp 90
> current hp 90
> this will also influence the strategy of party set up, tagteaming, etc.
> On Thu, Apr 30, 2009 at 11:40 AM, Alan Wolfe <alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> Hey just thought of something else too...
>> Eric if you hate the war of attrition we could go the route of the modern
>> games (or at least try it) like halo where you have hp but it recovers over
>> time (like when you are in back row or maybe not in combat... or potentially
>> all the time?)
>> Not sure if its a good idea, but its an idea :P
>> lol
>> On Thu, Apr 30, 2009 at 8:35 AM, Kent Petersen <kentkmp@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>> I like the FF view better myself.
>>> I'm am curious for the answer to Alan's questions as well.
>>> On Thu, Apr 30, 2009 at 8:32 AM, eric drewes <figarus@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>> 100% definitely.  either ff style or maybe where its 3rd person over teh
>>>> shoulder style.  i think you should be able to see them and with our
>>>> gameplay style i think it'll be needed to show whats going on - visually 
>>>> and
>>>> mechanically it'll be better.  i was actually gonna bring this up when we
>>>> got into more detailed combat stuff :) glad we're on the same page there
>>>> too.
>>>> On Thu, Apr 30, 2009 at 11:28 AM, Alan Wolfe <alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx>wrote:
>>>>> BTW what do you think about us changing our battle view from the dragon
>>>>> quest 5 view to the final fantasy view?
>>>>> I kinda miss being able to see the characters, and see the weapons /
>>>>> attacks and skills the players use.
>>>>> I think it makes the combat more epic and fun. Like think of fighting
>>>>> vargas or ultros where you see his tentacles slap your players, can you
>>>>> remember a fight like that at all in DQ5? i cant...most of the fights are
>>>>> unmemoriable, except for the ones where like 10 slimes form into the slime
>>>>> king hehe
>>>>> On Thu, Apr 30, 2009 at 8:25 AM, Alan Wolfe <alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx>wrote:
>>>>>> I think switching out your characters could work, that kinda sounds
>>>>>> cool and i can picture it in my head.
>>>>>> When you would switch, would you be able to switch any turn of combat,
>>>>>> only the first, or what?  Also is there a penalty to switching or is it 
>>>>>> for
>>>>>> free?  I'm just curious cause if one guy was dying you could swap him out
>>>>>> with another and have a fresh guy, is that ok?
>>>>>> If so we could do soemthing like marvel vs capcom i think it was,
>>>>>> where the team mates that are in the back row and not fighting slowly 
>>>>>> heal
>>>>>> their wounds (in this case they heal a small amount as round time
>>>>>> progresses) what you think?  If that is too overpowered, it could be
>>>>>> something like they can only heal maximum up to the life they had before
>>>>>> they got struck in the current battle.
>>>>>> Being held by one character and attacked by another makes sense.
>>>>>> Maybe its a skill, and what happens is when you use that skill, the
>>>>>> character that used it has to keep using it each turn to hold onto the
>>>>>> monster and that monster basically struggles each turn where it has some
>>>>>> chance to escape but that uses up it's turn.  Just like real life if you
>>>>>> oare outnumbered, grabbing hold of someone or wrestling around with them
>>>>>> wouldnt be a good idea cause his buddies would kick your butt, but if 
>>>>>> there
>>>>>> is like 1 monster left it could be a cool skill.  Like havin a guy like
>>>>>> sabin be able to grab the last enemy and hold him while your other guys 
>>>>>> hit
>>>>>> him would be a pretty useful skill (:
>>>>>> About the player never dying, on one hand i could see that working but
>>>>>> on the other, couldnt you just scrape through anyhwere by walking 
>>>>>> through a
>>>>>> dungeon and getting knocked out at each fight?  How do you balance that 
>>>>>> out?
>>>>>> Some cool ideas!
>>>>>> On Thu, Apr 30, 2009 at 6:36 AM, eric drewes <figarus@xxxxxxxxx>wrote:
>>>>>>> ok here is how i am thinking parties will work in combat...
>>>>>>> there will be 3 active party members in any fight and 4 on the
>>>>>>> sidelines that can be "tagged in" (swapped) as a combat option for any 
>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>> the active players INCLUDING the hero. this will allow you to sub out
>>>>>>> injured characters for fresh healthy ones, or if you want two people 
>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>> can do a special attack, you can have them sub in to pull of a coup de
>>>>>>> grace, or maybe there is a MATCHUP you want to exploit.
>>>>>>> Matchups? Huh?
>>>>>>> Matchups are basically already existing in games but without anything
>>>>>>> to quantify them.  basically, if you're in battle against a big slow 
>>>>>>> ogre or
>>>>>>> something, you can adjust your party to better match up w/ the enemy
>>>>>>> (enemies) you're fighting.  Maybe you want a big dude that can go
>>>>>>> mano-y-mano with the ogre, or a small quick dude who can exploit the 
>>>>>>> ogre's
>>>>>>> plodding attack and slow defense.  Maybe you're up against a flying 
>>>>>>> creature
>>>>>>> and arrows will be the best way to bring them down when standard attacks
>>>>>>> seem ineffectual.   Picking the best match up for what you're going 
>>>>>>> against
>>>>>>> can mean the difference of life and death.
>>>>>>> Injuries/status - we don't just want fights to be wars of attrition
>>>>>>> where you attack attack attack and try to slowly drain your foes life 
>>>>>>> (and
>>>>>>> vice versa) - in real life, this would be the equivelent of standing in
>>>>>>> front of someone and punching them back and forth until someone died.
>>>>>>> Silly!  i think most (if not all) of us are experienced martial artists 
>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>> we know fights don't work like that, there are holds, throws, etc that 
>>>>>>> can
>>>>>>> put your opponent in compromising situations that give you the 
>>>>>>> advantage.
>>>>>>> Add weapons to this and we have a fun system that is more dynamic than 
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> typical rpg combat system.  Examples of this would be 
>>>>>>> sweeps/tackles/throws
>>>>>>> that leave the enemy prone and thus unable to defend themselves as 
>>>>>>> well, or
>>>>>>> entangled via nets, maybe even HELD by one character while the others 
>>>>>>> beat
>>>>>>> it up (could we do this)?  or maybe getting maimed or hamstrung knocks 
>>>>>>> you
>>>>>>> over, getting stunned (like street fighter when you do a certain 
>>>>>>> combination
>>>>>>> the enemy can't move and has birds flying above their head) is another
>>>>>>> example.
>>>>>>> This style of combat would add a lot of depth and strategy and make
>>>>>>> combat feel more "alive" and dangerous and fun.  Also it adds a lot of
>>>>>>> potential skills and techniques to our future list
>>>>>>> Injuries - with our injury and death system, swapping to keep your
>>>>>>> team healthy is important.  This is kind of a big thing but I am sort of
>>>>>>> leaning towards thinking maybe MAYBE the hero can't die.  everyone else 
>>>>>>> can,
>>>>>>> but if the hero is "knocked out" in battle, he's back after the fight. 
>>>>>>> he
>>>>>>> can then go forward to try to find the next respawn node or maybe 
>>>>>>> theres a
>>>>>>> "Recall" option where you can revert to the start of the dungeon with 
>>>>>>> all
>>>>>>> your party members intact.  i think this will eliminate a lot of 
>>>>>>> frustration
>>>>>>> as well as prevent people from keeping the hero on the sidelines 
>>>>>>> worried he
>>>>>>> will die.
>>>>>>> just as a quick guess... i am thinking you get 7 active party members
>>>>>>> (3 active, 4 tagteamable) and then an additional 7 back at your "home 
>>>>>>> base"
>>>>>>> that you can swap out ff style whenever you're there for a total of 14 
>>>>>>> in
>>>>>>> your party.  We will (ideally) have 40-50 recruitable characters so this
>>>>>>> forces you to make some decisions on who you want to pick but also 
>>>>>>> gives you
>>>>>>> a large stable of characters so you don't feel like "shit, i have to 
>>>>>>> give up
>>>>>>> one of my favs".
>>>>>>> Just some thoughts... let me know what you think!

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