[project1dev] Re: The tail end of milestone 1

  • From: eric drewes <figarus@xxxxxxxxx>
  • To: project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
  • Date: Wed, 20 May 2009 16:19:05 -0400

theres a lot of neat ideas we had on that old forum, i keep forgetting to
check there but the wolf man idea reminded me

On Wed, May 20, 2009 at 4:16 PM, Alan Wolfe <alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> oh awesome eric
>
> maybe you could train your sidekicks too (thinkin it might be an
> application for that machine learnin stuff!)
> On Wed, May 20, 2009 at 1:15 PM, eric drewes <figarus@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
>> haha yeah, like i picture the area being filled with laid back pretty cool
>> undead dudes.
>>
>> hey for ooze (werewolf stuff) idea info:
>> http://atma.demofox.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=12
>>
>>
>> On Wed, May 20, 2009 at 4:13 PM, Alan Wolfe <alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>
>>> hey eric, we should do a joke too (like maybe it's part of this party)
>>> about like, what all the monsters do when no one is lookin...
>>>
>>> like skeletons jokin and smokin and they are like "oh crap here come some
>>> adventurers" toss their cigs into the fire and start grunting hehe
>>>   On Wed, May 20, 2009 at 1:12 PM, Alan Wolfe <alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx>wrote:
>>>
>>>> okies (:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, May 20, 2009 at 1:07 PM, eric drewes <figarus@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> i think the idea with the costume sounds funny where you crash a
>>>>> bizarre monster party or soemthing, we can work that in - why not?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Wed, May 20, 2009 at 4:04 PM, Alan Wolfe <alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx>wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> yeah it kinda would (:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> hey eric since we are going more linear storyline now, does that mean
>>>>>> choices you make aren't going to affect the storyline so much?  (i'm
>>>>>> assuming that they won't)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And how much leeway do we have for optional things like becoming a
>>>>>> wearwolf and stuff like that, besides just as part of a sandboxed area -
>>>>>> like a quest where you can become a warewolf temporarily and are limited
>>>>>> where you can go, then later on youre cured and let out - er yeah, like
>>>>>> beyond that would we let them just be a warewolf for the rest of the 
>>>>>> game?
>>>>>>   On Wed, May 20, 2009 at 12:58 PM, Kent Petersen 
>>>>>> <kentkmp@xxxxxxxxx>wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> It would be pretty cool if you could somehow become a were-creature
>>>>>>> or undead as well
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I hope to see dracula drop his ice cream some day =P
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Wed, May 20, 2009 at 12:52 PM, Alan Wolfe 
>>>>>>> <alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx>wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> and explanation for everyone else...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> previously before i got a job makin games, me and kent were makin a
>>>>>>>> side scrolling game where you played as megaman.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> the "main boss" was dracula from one of the castlevania games hehe
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> we wanted to have a cut scene where he was eating his ice cream and
>>>>>>>> it like, fell on the floor or something and he got sad
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> yeah... hahah
>>>>>>>>   On Wed, May 20, 2009 at 12:50 PM, Alan Wolfe <
>>>>>>>> alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> lol about dracula eating ice cream
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> this might be a really gay idea (and i dont mean in the olde
>>>>>>>>> english way haha) but...
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> back when we were thinking more of an open world, i was thinking it
>>>>>>>>> would be rad if there was like, a monster party w/ vampires and 
>>>>>>>>> warewolves
>>>>>>>>> and skeletons and stuff.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> if you went in there as something like that it'd be a chill palce
>>>>>>>>> to hang out and stuff
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> but if you went in there as a normal dude or a paladin or something
>>>>>>>>> they'd rip you up
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> if something at all fits like that in our game (maybe you can wear
>>>>>>>>> a costume or maybe if you go in with someone undead in your party 
>>>>>>>>> they are
>>>>>>>>> cool to you) we could have dracula eating ice cream there maybe lol
>>>>>>>>>   On Wed, May 20, 2009 at 12:44 PM, eric drewes <figarus@xxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>>> > wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> definitely lots or weird hidden mini things everywhere!
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, May 20, 2009 at 3:38 PM, Kent Petersen <kentkmp@xxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>>>> > wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Speaking of that are we going to have weird hidden mini bonuses?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Alan, you still owe me dracula eating ice cream!
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, May 20, 2009 at 12:37 PM, Alan Wolfe <
>>>>>>>>>>> alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> lol that's awesome (:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> are you thinking of using billboarded sprites for all the art or
>>>>>>>>>>>> something?
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, May 20, 2009 at 12:35 PM, eric drewes <
>>>>>>>>>>>> figarus@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> secretly, wurmz and i are planning a mini level where you get
>>>>>>>>>>>>> thrown into a land w/ pixel art and 8 bit music, etc. but dont 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> tell alan
>>>>>>>>>>>>> shhhh
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, May 20, 2009 at 3:20 PM, Nick Klotz <
>>>>>>>>>>>>> roracsenshi@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I agree; 8-bit is awesome.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, May 20, 2009 at 1:39 PM, Chris Sherman <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cshermandesign@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I think we should make an epic game that roxors in the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> graphic and coding department but the sound is all 8bit old 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> school!!!! Sorry
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> had a lot of sugar for lunch :p
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent from my BlackBerry
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *From*: figarus@xxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *Date*: Wed, 20 May 2009 18:33:34 +0000
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *To*: <project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *Subject*: [project1dev] Re: The tail end of milestone 1
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>  Not just games... When you paint a picture, you don't just
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> focus on the nose till its perfect then move onto the eyes. 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> We'll build the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> structure of the game first but it'll take 2 or 3 coats of 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> paint before its
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> done. Even while the milestone 1 is "done" - it will likely be 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> drastically
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> altered visually and mechanically (sound etc) by the time the 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> game is ready
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for release.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Baby steps :)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *From*: Alan Wolfe
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *Date*: Wed, 20 May 2009 11:11:24 -0700
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *To*: <project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *Subject*: [project1dev] Re: The tail end of milestone 1
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> oh and yeah, hopefully sound will be coming in either this
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> milestone or next (depending on what we have time for!)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> another thing about the milestones is we want to balance the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> amount of tech work needed and the amount of art work needed so 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that one
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> side isn't waiting on the other too much.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> like if the cave is prettied up 100% but there's no sound,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> you artists shouldnt have to wait while i code in sound support.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> You could move onto the next milestone but keeping everyone
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> focused on the same area and keeping us all on the same page 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (at least for
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> now in the beginning while we are still hammering things out) 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> is worth more
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> than being fully feature complete right away.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is a pretty common thing for games too
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Like, games work towards alpha while making their content
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (maps, art, etc).
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Alpha means the game is fully playable from start to finish.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Beta means that it's feature complete (note that it isnt
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> feature complete until AFTER it's fully playable)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> then from beta to release, it's just bug fixes and final spit
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and pollish (:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, May 20, 2009 at 11:07 AM, Alan Wolfe <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Yeah exactly
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> we don't want to sit around in one area and wait on the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> entire game to be fleshed out, or we'd be waiting forever and 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> be stuck on
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this cave for months and months and months longer and 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> meanwhile have nothing
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> else done.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The purpose of the milestones is to break up creating the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> game into bitesized chunks that get us closer and closer to a 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> full
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> featureset and a full game.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> We'll come back to it, but it's served it's purpose for now
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and is like 90% of the way there so as soon as we have more of 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a game world
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> we can hook it in and finish it up (:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   On Wed, May 20, 2009 at 10:44 AM, Kent Petersen <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> kentkmp@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I believe adding sound is a large task. We will revisit the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cave later once we know where it will fit into the world and 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> we will be able
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to add in all the new features we have created then.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, May 20, 2009 at 10:42 AM, Matthew Freeland <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mattthefiend@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> By the way I Think an important thing to work on some
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sound milestones before we move away from the mine. Just a 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> thought.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, May 20, 2009 at 10:00 AM, Alan Wolfe <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Oh and Eric wants to do #5, and i will do #4 if no one
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> else wants to (but feel free if you want to!!).
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> And i'll be doin #6 for sure.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> not sure how the rest of it falls! (:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>  On Wed, May 20, 2009 at 8:40 AM, Alan Wolfe <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hey Everyone,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This first milestone working on the cave has worked out
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a lot of issues with workflow and gotten us a basic set of 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> features (enemy
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> pathing, AI and a basic level editor) and preformance 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> upgrades.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> These were some of the main goals of this first
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> milestone so mission accomplished!
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Since we don't know where exactly this cave is going to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> fit in with the rest of the world, Eric was thinking it 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> would be best (even
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for the sake of sanity because we've been working on this 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> area for so long)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to forgo to pollish phase of this map and leave it at 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> about 90% finished
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> until we do know the details of where it's going in the 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> world and can finish
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it up then, and I agree that is a good idea.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Here's the things he identified as wanting to finish up
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> before we move on:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> #1) Put the new boss art in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> #2) Animate the dog men
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> #3) Replace the stationary miner art
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> #4) Finish decorating the cave with the props we have
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (and any that anyone is working on)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> #5) Do a lighting pass
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> #6) I want to do an optimization pass for the models
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cause i think a few models we can reduce the number of 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> verts without losing
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any major visual quality (and i'll run the simplified 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> models by everyone
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> before i check them in to make sure I don't ugly things up 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> too much).  This
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> should boost overall performance which will let us place 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> more objects while
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> maintaining higher frame rates.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Anything else that anyone really wants to get in or does
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that sound ok to everyone?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> There are some known issues that we are just going to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> leave for now (unless they are quick fixes and anyone 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wants to tackle any!),
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that we'll deal with when we come back to the cave later 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> on:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> * the boss is too tall and clips through the bridge
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (might be fixed with new art but maybe not)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> * you can walk around and through the rocks that caved
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> * theres places in the map you can still fall through
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the ground into infinity
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> * there's a few places where z fighting still happens
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> * Others: we haven't gone through a QA pass or play
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> tested it to find the bugs we don't know about.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Eric and I are finalizing the details of the 2nd
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> milestone to make sure it makes sense from both a creative 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and technical POV
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and the details will be released by the end of the week.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Great job everyone, we are really kicking ass and this
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> is shaping up to be a great team! (:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>

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