[project1dev] Re: Project1 - SVN Update 243
- From: eric drewes <figarus@xxxxxxxxx>
- To: project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 18:39:56 -0400
oh and it also changes the position, but basically the lesson is we have to
be sure to fix everything in milkshape, and i apologize for not checking
them yesterday...
On Thu, Jun 18, 2009 at 6:30 PM, eric drewes <figarus@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> importing into milkshape changes the scale and rotation of the object from
> c4d and 3ds, just fyi... so the recentering to origin and the scaling will
> have to be done IN milkshape
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 18, 2009 at 6:27 PM, eric drewes <figarus@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
>> i did rotate the one (sorry!!!), but they are the exact same size/scale
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Jun 18, 2009 at 6:24 PM, eric drewes <figarus@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>
>>> *hides in the corner*
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Jun 18, 2009 at 5:38 PM, Alan Wolfe <alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx>wrote:
>>>
>>>> i'd say try it again
>>>>
>>>> i don't want to say user error is the cause but it would be bad to throw
>>>> out the possibility of only having to work in better applications because
>>>> of
>>>> one mysterious circumstance :P
>>>>
>>>> we should try it again and see, maybe something weird happened somewhere
>>>> along the chain from source to destination
>>>>
>>>> heck for all we know the engine could have rotated it wrong when it
>>>> loaded the model - in which case it's a bug i need to fix anyways
>>>> On Thu, Jun 18, 2009 at 2:12 PM, eric drewes <figarus@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> i imported the two tiles using the same methods and they are both built
>>>>> off the same original tile... they ended up different scales and rotation
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, Jun 18, 2009 at 5:11 PM, eric drewes <figarus@xxxxxxxxx>wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> everything will have to be fixed in milkshape since it apparently
>>>>>> imports randomly... not a big issue, just something we need to be
>>>>>> conscious
>>>>>> of
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Thu, Jun 18, 2009 at 4:51 PM, Alan Wolfe <alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx>wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> yeah thats a good point Chris
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> And the common denominator between all our art is milkshape which is
>>>>>>> hardly a good thing.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> maybe let's try it and see, like make some objects in the different
>>>>>>> programs we are using, like a 10x10x10 cube in each and see if they all
>>>>>>> come
>>>>>>> through the import process the same size
>>>>>>> On Thu, Jun 18, 2009 at 1:49 PM, Chris Sherman <
>>>>>>> cshermandesign@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Unit measurement is a great way to keep things uniformly scaled.
>>>>>>>> Will this work cross platform though since some of us are using c4d,
>>>>>>>> maya,
>>>>>>>> 3ds Max? Just curious because I've not worked with so many diff 3d
>>>>>>>> progs
>>>>>>>> before
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Sent from my BlackBerry
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>>>> *From*: Kent Petersen
>>>>>>>> *Date*: Thu, 18 Jun 2009 13:26:29 -0700
>>>>>>>> *To*: <project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>>>>> *Subject*: [project1dev] Re: Project1 - SVN Update 243
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Let's say we use 1 unit = 1 cm. I imagined these tiles were about
>>>>>>>> 1x1 foot which is almost 30 cm. I should then have all the times be 30
>>>>>>>> units
>>>>>>>> in size right? Will adapting this jack up the cave? The scaling in
>>>>>>>> there may
>>>>>>>> be all weird by comparison. How tall is the player? If we are to put
>>>>>>>> in a
>>>>>>>> standard we should definitely do it before we continue with
>>>>>>>> construction of
>>>>>>>> the voidmap or temple.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Thu, Jun 18, 2009 at 1:23 PM, Kent Petersen
>>>>>>>> <kentkmp@xxxxxxxxx>wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Having the origin above ground but ground level sounds reasonable
>>>>>>>>> for things like sign posts but what about a person. Where should their
>>>>>>>>> origin be? In between their feet?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Jun 18, 2009 at 1:22 PM, Kent Petersen
>>>>>>>>> <kentkmp@xxxxxxxxx>wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Alan - Model Viewing - When I said that I imagined a 3d space with
>>>>>>>>>> lines on it and maybe a dot for center. This would help to see if
>>>>>>>>>> things are
>>>>>>>>>> centered and sitting right in a correct rotation/position
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Jun 18, 2009 at 1:19 PM, eric drewes
>>>>>>>>>> <figarus@xxxxxxxxx>wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> i would say, everything should sit above the origin
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Jun 18, 2009 at 4:17 PM, Alan Wolfe <
>>>>>>>>>>> alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> How's this?
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> 1 unit = 1cm
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> if soemthing is going to be placed on the ground, it's centered
>>>>>>>>>>>> at the origin but sits "above ground" ie for the fortune teller
>>>>>>>>>>>> sign, the
>>>>>>>>>>>> bottom of the sign post would be at the origin.
>>>>>>>>>>>> for objects which fly or float (such as puff balls) the origin
>>>>>>>>>>>> is their middle.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Or if you want we can just always have the origin be at the
>>>>>>>>>>>> bottom of every object if you want to just straight up unify
>>>>>>>>>>>> everything.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Jun 18, 2009 at 1:10 PM, eric drewes <figarus@xxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>>>>>> > wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> ok so what convention should we use?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Jun 18, 2009 at 4:00 PM, Matthew Freeland <
>>>>>>>>>>>>> mattthefiend@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Indeed. Using a fixed size for movement helps make mapping a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ton easier! Being able to nudge something 1 step just a tiny bit
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a bunch of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> times makes it really easy to fine-tune things into place.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Jun 18, 2009 at 12:57 PM, Kent Petersen <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> kentkmp@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Eric - don't worry about it. I am just pointing out that it
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sucks now so we can fix it later.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Alan - Is there a way we can have something you load the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> model into so you can see if it will fit into our world right?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Like maybe it
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> would have a dot in the center so you know how where its
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rotation point is.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Maybe it will also show you the X,Y,Z tilt so you know if its
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> facing up
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> right or sitting on its side. Maybe I can script like a demo
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> map that you
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> pop a model into and it will show you how it sits.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I also like the idea of a standard size. That would be very
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> helpful when it comes time to building more complex levels.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Jun 18, 2009 at 12:54 PM, Kent Petersen <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> kentkmp@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I HAV DA SCRIPTZ POWAH! That is a good idea. It would be
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> easy to tile everything.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I didn't put too much effort into tiling it all up now
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> because I know its going to move to the temple later and have
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to redo it all
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (see those mega man mistakes are paying off).
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Should there be any future changes to the way things rotate
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and scale? If I go through and tweak everything to work right
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> again (or
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rewrite the rotation/scaling scripts in some situations) will
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> there be
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> something that will cause me to go through again?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I think it would be cool if in the editor you could set the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> snap to amount. For example, if I were tiling a floor and the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> distance of a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> tile was 7.2 I could then set the snap to that and easily tile
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the whole
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> thing.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Jun 18, 2009 at 12:47 PM, Alan Wolfe <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hey Kent,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I totally agree we need to standardize the position of the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> art and perhaps the scaling too (like in unreal, one unit = 1
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cm, we could
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> do something like that in our game as well).
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this is just a hack solution to part of the problem but
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> since you have TEH PWOERZ OF TEH SKRIPT!!!
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> you could procedurally generate geometry in the_geometry
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> file via script.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> how the map editor loads a map is it runs the script file
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (ie voidmap_geometry) and when it saves it, it loops through
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> all the objects
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that are loaded and writes out lua commands to load them etc.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> so what that means is you could code a double for loop (ie
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ... for x { for y {} }) to place down the tiles.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> then, when you load it in the editor (or someone else does)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it will run your script and place the tiles.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> then, when you save the map, it will save the non script
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> version (ie as if it WERE placed with the editor but it
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wasnt).
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> does that make sense? im hopin that at least helps the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> problem a little.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> but yeah i wanna make the editor as painless as possible
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> too so we can continue to make it better if you have ideas.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Jun 18, 2009 at 12:40 PM, Apache User <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> dhapache@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> User:korgath
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Message: added erics art to the Arrow.lua
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> added the diamond tiles to gridtest. its possible now!
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> added regular tiles to gridtest
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> added regular tiles to tiletrap kinda
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> added regular tiles to trapdoor
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Complaints. I found it easier to use scripting that I did
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the editor. It was very difficult to try and tile the ground
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> using the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> editor.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I also found it difficult to get scaling just right. I am
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> thinking the models may not be centered right. I can't palce
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> my finger on it
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> but its bothering me. Check out the tiletrap, I just cant
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> get it to look
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> right anymore.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I am having a hard time getting the models to position
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> without a ton of work. I think there should be an art
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> standard. For example
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the rotation and scale on the diamond tile is different than
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the blank tile.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> So scripting both in took a lot of work and configuring and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they dont mesh
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> together right when tiled.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Basically, the entire process was a total bitch.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <Files Changed>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> U Scripts/Enemies/Traps/Arrow.lua
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> U Scripts/Enemies/Traps/tiletrap.lua
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> U Scripts/Enemies/Traps/trapdoor.lua
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> U Scripts/Maps/gridtest.lua
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> U Scripts/Maps/gridtest_geometry.lua
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> U Scripts/Maps/kenttest.lua
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
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