[project1dev] Re: Maps
- From: eric drewes <figarus@xxxxxxxxx>
- To: project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Fri, 26 Feb 2010 18:44:32 -0500
good info, pretty interesting - thanks for the lesson :)
On Fri, Feb 26, 2010 at 2:45 PM, Alan Wolfe <alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> most games use mip maps, but it's just an engine internal thing, sometimes
> used for tuning memory.
>
> Specifically how mip maps work:
>
> If i load a 1024x1024 image into memory and tell it to make mip maps, it'll
> scale it down to make a 512x512 version, a 256x256 version, a 128x128
> version etc all the way down to like 1x1 i believe and it will store all of
> those in memory.
>
> What you can do though if you are overbudget in memory you can specify how
> many mip maps to create, less mip maps = less memory used.
>
> Also, you could do something like in that 1024x1024 example, you can tell
> it to throw away the mips > 256x256.
>
> This will make the texture look more lower resolution but in the process
> you saved 4MB from the 1024x1024 image and 1MB from the 512x512 image so in
> total you saved 5MB of memory just from doing that.
>
> You might find some texture in the game that isnt really important (maybe
> its only shown in one place players hardly ever see or maybe it is only
> shown from really far away anyways) and then turn down the mips to get some
> memory back.
>
> This isn't the kind of stuff you'll likely ever have to deal with but might
> be good info to know.
>
> I think usually technical artists and programmers deal with this kind of
> thing.
>
>
> On Fri, Feb 26, 2010 at 10:05 AM, katie cook <ktmcook@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
>> Yeah, I already got the plug in. I dug around and researched it
>> yesterday.
>>
>> I use Maya so I am trying to see what the best route is for possibly using
>> normal maps. I am still discovering mudbox, and I don't know how easy it is
>> to get my hands on that, and if it is something I want to integrate into my
>> workflow. Still exploring that possibility...
>>
>>
>> --- On *Fri, 2/26/10, Larvantholos <larvantholos@xxxxxxxx>* wrote:
>>
>>
>> From: Larvantholos <larvantholos@xxxxxxxx>
>> Subject: [project1dev] Re: Maps
>> To: project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Date: Friday, February 26, 2010, 9:56 AM
>>
>>
>> Its an nvidia plugin you can get from their website, it allows you to edit
>> and draw on the maps, as well as create them within photoshop. You'll get a
>> better affect create the map in 3d - if you get your hands on mudbox even
>> just for rendering purposes it creates excellent normal mapping which in 3ds
>> max compatible mode will let you use it in most other programs :)
>>
>> --- On Fri, 2/26/10, katie cook
>> <ktmcook@xxxxxxxxx<http://us.mc361.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=ktmcook@xxxxxxxxx>>
>> wrote:
>>
>> > From: katie cook
>> > <ktmcook@xxxxxxxxx<http://us.mc361.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=ktmcook@xxxxxxxxx>
>> >
>> > Subject: [project1dev] Re: Maps
>> > To:
>> > project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<http://us.mc361.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> > Received: Friday, February 26, 2010, 12:53 PM
>> > Yeah I know mip maps are
>> > different than other kinds of maps =)
>> >
>> > I was looking into getting a plugin for photoshop that
>> > allows you to make normal maps from a grayscale image, and
>> > the plug in specs talk about factoring for mip mapping for a
>> > certain execution.
>> >
>> > Katie
>> >
>> > --- On Thu, 2/25/10, Alan Wolfe
>> > <alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx<http://us.mc361.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx>>
>> wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> > From: Alan Wolfe
>> > <alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx<http://us.mc361.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx>
>> >
>> > Subject: [project1dev] Re: Maps
>> > To:
>> > project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<http://us.mc361.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> > Date: Thursday, February 25, 2010, 2:40 PM
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Yeah
>> >
>> > mip mapping is usually taken care of by the engine
>> > although i think sometimes the artists can specify # of mips
>> > for specific textures.
>> >
>> > Basically, in a 3d game, the video card has
>> > to be able to render textures at different scales (as you
>> > notice, when something gets farther away from the camera it
>> > gets smaller...).
>> >
>> > It can do this one of 2 ways..
>> >
>> > #1 - scale down the image on the fly every frame (this
>> > usually either results in textures being scaled quickly so
>> > that they are ugly, or results in frame rate dropping
>> > because they are scaling the textures nicely which takes
>> > longer)
>> > #2 - Scale the image a bunch when it's first
>> > loaded and store the scaled images in memory. This is
>> > called mip mapping and lets you scale images nicely (ie
>> > bilinear or trilinear filtering etc) and store them in
>> > memory. This makes it so you use more video memory but
>> > scaled textures look better and the game runs faster.
>> >
>> > Im curious, what has you investigating mip maps?
>> > (:
>> >
>> > and btw, mip maps are not the same kind of map like
>> > specular maps and normal maps are, it's a completely
>> > different kind of thing.
>> >
>> > On Thu, Feb 25, 2010 at 2:26 PM,
>> > katie cook
>> > <ktmcook@xxxxxxxxx<http://us.mc361.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=ktmcook@xxxxxxxxx>
>> >
>> > wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Hey Guys,
>> >
>> > Another question, does anyone know much about MIP
>> > mapping? I get the general concept of what it is/what it
>> > does, but I am wondering if it is applicable in our
>> > situation, or in what situation/game it would be
>> > applicable...
>> >
>> > Gonna google it too, but any info you guys have would
>> > be much appreciated. Its always better from a artists point
>> > of view. =)
>> >
>> > Thanks
>> > Katie
>> >
>> >
>> > --- On Thu, 2/25/10, Alan Wolfe
>> > <alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx<http://us.mc361.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx>
>> >
>> > wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > From: Alan Wolfe
>> > <alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx<http://us.mc361.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx>
>> >
>> > Subject: [project1dev] Re: Maps
>> > To:
>> > project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<http://us.mc361.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> > Date: Thursday, February 25, 2010, 2:21 PM
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Hey Katie,
>> >
>> > Currently I'm upgrading the editor but after that
>> > I'll be moving back to graphics land and upgradin our
>> > graphics.
>> >
>> > Milkshape supports NO maps.
>> >
>> > Our game however currently supports normal maps
>> > (doesnt look like it should cause it needs an upgrade but it
>> > works).
>> >
>> > For now we (Kent or I) have to set up the loading
>> > level script to apply the normal maps to an object (which is
>> > no problem, nothin to worry about there)
>> >
>> > In the future, you'll be able to apply the normal
>> > map from the editor.
>> >
>> > Now because you are asking about other kinds of maps
>> > like specular maps, YEP we can do those!
>> >
>> > The game doesnt currently support them but specular
>> > maps for one should be not too hard so feel free to use them
>> > (:
>> >
>> > On Thu, Feb 25, 2010 at 2:14 PM,
>> > katie cook
>> > <ktmcook@xxxxxxxxx<http://us.mc361.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=ktmcook@xxxxxxxxx>
>> >
>> > wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > I think the kids need more maps, there just arent very
>> > many maps....=) ANYWAY,
>> >
>> > Hey Guys,
>> >
>> > I was wondering about what kind of maps the
>> > game/milkshape supports, IE. bump, specular, normal
>> > maps.
>> >
>> > Let me know what you know and limitations your aware
>> > of.
>> >
>> > Thinking about learning/playing with normal and
>> > specular maps, but thinking probably only bumps are going to
>> > be supported for now...
>> >
>> > Wishful thinking, some fun ideas in mind. =)
>> >
>> > Katie
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
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>>
>
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