[project1dev] Re: Maps

  • From: Alan Wolfe <alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx>
  • To: project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
  • Date: Fri, 26 Feb 2010 11:45:18 -0800

most games use mip maps, but it's just an engine internal thing, sometimes
used for tuning memory.

Specifically how mip maps work:

If i load a 1024x1024 image into memory and tell it to make mip maps, it'll
scale it down to make a 512x512 version, a 256x256 version, a 128x128
version etc all the way down to like 1x1 i believe and it will store all of
those in memory.

What you can do though if you are overbudget in memory you can specify how
many mip maps to create, less mip maps = less memory used.

Also, you could do something like in that 1024x1024 example, you can tell it
to throw away the mips > 256x256.

This will make the texture look more lower resolution but in the process you
saved 4MB from the 1024x1024 image and 1MB from the 512x512 image so in
total you saved 5MB of memory just from doing that.

You might find some texture in the game that isnt really important (maybe
its only shown in one place players hardly ever see or maybe it is only
shown from really far away anyways) and then turn down the mips to get some
memory back.

This isn't the kind of stuff you'll likely ever have to deal with but might
be good info to know.

I think usually technical artists and programmers deal with this kind of
thing.

On Fri, Feb 26, 2010 at 10:05 AM, katie cook <ktmcook@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> Yeah, I already got the plug in. I dug around and researched it yesterday.
>
> I use Maya so I am trying to see what the best route is for possibly using
> normal maps. I am still discovering mudbox, and I don't know how easy it is
> to get my hands on that, and if it is something I want to integrate into my
> workflow. Still exploring that possibility...
>
>
> --- On *Fri, 2/26/10, Larvantholos <larvantholos@xxxxxxxx>* wrote:
>
>
> From: Larvantholos <larvantholos@xxxxxxxx>
> Subject: [project1dev] Re: Maps
> To: project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Date: Friday, February 26, 2010, 9:56 AM
>
>
> Its an nvidia plugin you can get from their website, it allows you to edit
> and draw on the maps, as well as create them within photoshop. You'll get a
> better affect create the map in 3d - if you get your hands on mudbox even
> just for rendering purposes it creates excellent normal mapping which in 3ds
> max compatible mode will let you use it in most other programs :)
>
> --- On Fri, 2/26/10, katie cook 
> <ktmcook@xxxxxxxxx<http://us.mc361.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=ktmcook@xxxxxxxxx>>
> wrote:
>
> > From: katie cook 
> > <ktmcook@xxxxxxxxx<http://us.mc361.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=ktmcook@xxxxxxxxx>
> >
> > Subject: [project1dev] Re: Maps
> > To: 
> > project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<http://us.mc361.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > Received: Friday, February 26, 2010, 12:53 PM
> > Yeah I know mip maps are
> > different than other kinds of maps =)
> >
> > I was looking into getting a plugin for photoshop that
> > allows you to make normal maps from a grayscale image, and
> > the plug in specs talk about factoring for mip mapping for a
> > certain execution.
> >
> > Katie
> >
> > --- On Thu, 2/25/10, Alan Wolfe
> > <alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx<http://us.mc361.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx>>
> wrote:
> >
> >
> > From: Alan Wolfe 
> > <alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx<http://us.mc361.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx>
> >
> > Subject: [project1dev] Re: Maps
> > To: 
> > project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<http://us.mc361.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > Date: Thursday, February 25, 2010, 2:40 PM
> >
> >
> >
> > Yeah
> >
> > mip mapping is usually taken care of by the engine
> > although i think sometimes the artists can specify # of mips
> > for specific textures.
> >
> > Basically, in a 3d game, the video card has
> > to be able to render textures at different scales (as you
> > notice, when something gets farther away from the camera it
> > gets smaller...).
> >
> > It can do this one of 2 ways..
> >
> > #1 - scale down the image on the fly every frame (this
> > usually either results in textures being scaled quickly so
> > that they are ugly, or results in frame rate dropping
> > because they are scaling the textures nicely which takes
> > longer)
> > #2 - Scale the image a bunch when it's first
> > loaded and store the scaled images in memory.  This is
> > called mip mapping and lets you scale images nicely (ie
> > bilinear or trilinear filtering etc) and store them in
> > memory.  This makes it so you use more video memory but
> > scaled textures look better and the game runs faster.
> >
> > Im curious, what has you investigating mip maps?
> > (:
> >
> > and btw, mip maps are not the same kind of map like
> > specular maps and normal maps are, it's a completely
> > different kind of thing.
> >
> > On Thu, Feb 25, 2010 at 2:26 PM,
> > katie cook 
> > <ktmcook@xxxxxxxxx<http://us.mc361.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=ktmcook@xxxxxxxxx>
> >
> > wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Hey Guys,
> >
> > Another question, does anyone know much about MIP
> > mapping? I get the general concept of what it is/what it
> > does, but I am wondering if it is applicable in our
> > situation, or in what situation/game it would be
> > applicable...
> >
> > Gonna google it too, but any info you guys have would
> > be much appreciated. Its always better from a artists point
> > of view. =)
> >
> > Thanks
> > Katie
> >
> >
> > --- On Thu, 2/25/10, Alan Wolfe 
> > <alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx<http://us.mc361.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx>
> >
> > wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > From: Alan Wolfe 
> > <alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx<http://us.mc361.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=alan.wolfe@xxxxxxxxx>
> >
> > Subject: [project1dev] Re: Maps
> > To: 
> > project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<http://us.mc361.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=project1dev@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > Date: Thursday, February 25, 2010, 2:21 PM
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Hey Katie,
> >
> > Currently I'm upgrading the editor but after that
> > I'll be moving back to graphics land and upgradin our
> > graphics.
> >
> > Milkshape supports NO maps.
> >
> > Our game however currently supports normal maps
> > (doesnt look like it should cause it needs an upgrade but it
> > works).
> >
> > For now we (Kent or I) have to set up the loading
> > level script to apply the normal maps to an object (which is
> > no problem, nothin to worry about there)
> >
> > In the future, you'll be able to apply the normal
> > map from the editor.
> >
> > Now because you are asking about other kinds of maps
> > like specular maps, YEP we can do those!
> >
> > The game doesnt currently support them but specular
> > maps for one should be not too hard so feel free to use them
> > (:
> >
> > On Thu, Feb 25, 2010 at 2:14 PM,
> > katie cook 
> > <ktmcook@xxxxxxxxx<http://us.mc361.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=ktmcook@xxxxxxxxx>
> >
> > wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > I think the kids need more maps, there just arent very
> > many maps....=) ANYWAY,
> >
> > Hey Guys,
> >
> > I was wondering about what kind of maps the
> > game/milkshape supports, IE. bump, specular, normal
> > maps.
> >
> > Let me know what you know and limitations your aware
> > of.
> >
> > Thinking about learning/playing with normal and
> > specular maps, but thinking probably only bumps are going to
> > be supported for now...
> >
> > Wishful thinking, some fun ideas in mind. =)
> >
> > Katie
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
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