RE: jaws and seven: accessibility, settings, etc.

  • From: Øyvind Lode <oyvind.lode@xxxxxxxxx>
  • To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 16:26:03 +0100

Hi Ken!

The Arch install is accessible.
Not the official ISO, but there is a custom Talking Arch install ISO.

I've been playing with VMWare for a while now.
I really like the option of having the virtual text consoles available just
like on a real Linux machine.
But I've run into some trouble when connecting/disconnecting my Braille
display.
Most of the time it works, but it's a bit cumbersome since I need to switch
between my host and VM all the time.
Today Braille broke completely in VMWare and I had to reboot the host
machine.
The Braille driver refused to load both on the host machine and in VMWare.
And this is not the first time...

When using Cygwin this is not an issue.
The drawback of Cygwin as an ssh client is the poor Braille support JAWS
offer on the command line.
I can't use the routing buttons etc, which works well with brltty on Linux
(also in VMWare).
I also miss the virtual text consoles.

I'm actually considering going back to Cygwin.

When will FS fix the echoing of speech when using cygwin and cmd.exe on
Windows 7?



-----Original Message-----
From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Ken Perry
Sent: 16. mars 2010 03:46
To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: jaws and seven: accessibility, settings, etc.



You will find the easiest way to get going with vm ware is to use ubuntu and
the easy installer vm water has.  If you have to install your own OS in the
player it's not accessible unless the install talks.  Ubuntu on the other
hand has a simple easy install system.  You get them all installed and shut
off the GUI and your all set.  

Ken

-----Original Message-----
From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Øyvind Lode
Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 12:00 PM
To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: jaws and seven: accessibility, settings, etc.

As I said I prefer Linux as a server OS (webserver running Linux, Apache,
Mysql and PHP).
My web server is currently running Debian, but I'm moving to Arch Linux
soon.
To do administrative tasks on these machines I ssh into them from the
virtual machine running Vinux.

I don't care about the GUI in Vinux so I always switch to the text console.
I'm going to install VMWare Player 3 and try to create my own VM.
I'm going to run Arch Linux in the VM since it's now my favorite distro.

I always try to be a honest guy, so I have a hard time recommending GNOME
and Orca to a blind person.
I'm blind myself, quite familiar with Linux/UNIX but Orca is pretty useless.
Ok, it's not necessarily always Orca which fails directly, but rather caused
by bugs in other parts of GNOME.
Lot's of dependencies which can go wrong, webkit, at-spi, at-registry (which
currently makes Orca crash very often) etc etc.
Pulseaudio (the new audio subsystem) also introduces a lot of problems for
the blind.
Fortunately not all distros have moved to PulseAudio yet and some of these
issues has been addressed and fixed.
I really want the Linux desktop to be good for me and other blind people,
but I guess wishing won't make it happen.

That said, the Linux command line (the virtual text consoles) is very
accessible.
I use Speakup and brltty on the command line to perform sys. Admin tasks
both at work and home.

So if you want to try Linux as a desktop OS your best bet is Ubuntu and
Vinux.

Personally I don't bother trying out Linux at the desktop anymore.
Windows is my preferred desktop OS.


-----Original Message-----
From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of chris hallsworth
Sent: 15. mars 2010 11:54
To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: jaws and seven: accessibility, settings, etc.

Hi sounds interesting. What Linux do you use? I tried Ubuntu and Vinux 
so far. Not a fan of Linux but I like to try things especially in a 
virtual environment. I like to see how things work.


Chris Hallsworth
E-mail and Facebook: christopherh40@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
MSN: ch9675@xxxxxxxxxxx
Skype: chrishallsworth7266
Twitter: www.twitter.com/christopherh40

On 14/03/2010 10:38, Øyvind Lode wrote:
> I also considered moving to Linux at some point.
> But after using GNOME and Orca for a while I'm not going back.
> I'll probably use Windows and JAWS forever as my desktop OS, but Linux is
> still my favorite server OS.
>
> I like the Linux command line for system administration and that's what I
> use the virtual machine for.
> I use speakup and brltty to perform sys. Admin tasks on remote hosts
> (including my own web server).
>
> The reason I dropped cygwin for this is due to brltty's excellent handling
> of consoles and the VM also gives me 6 virtual consoles by default.
> I find the virtual consoles very powerful and useful.
>
> I'm considering setting up samba on my local web server to allow me to
edit
> files using my favorite text editor in windows.
> But I guess expand drive is a better approach since this allows me access
to
> remote machines using sshfs.
> I have shell access on all remote machines.
>
> But using cygwin to mount the remote filesystems over ssh sounds very
> interesting.
> I don't remember the command from the top of my head, but I remember that
> I've mounted remote filesystems from Linux using ssh...
> How do you do it?
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Ken Perry
> Sent: 14. mars 2010 05:22
> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: RE: jaws and seven: accessibility, settings, etc.
>
>
>
> I have dropped cygwin for the time and us vmware player but it's not the
> same.  The orca is just slow as snails and I have yet to put speakup on.
I
> have been thinking of using emacspeak till Jaws gets cygwin fixed but the
> reason I want to use cygwin is so I can use my favorite editor in windows.
> If boxer was in Linux and Linux x with orca was faster I would be gone
from
> windows.
>
> Now with that all said FS is working on the problem so I am hoping they
get
> it fixed quickly for now I am using Secure crt and expand drive to allow
me
> to do what I used to do with cygwin.  I have a vm ware machine running 3
> Linux boxes and secure crt and expand drive but man I miss cygwin.
>
> Ken
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Øyvind Lode
> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 2:27 PM
> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: RE: jaws and seven:accessibility, settings, etc.
>
> Sorry!
> I actually have the same problem and it's a bit annoying.
> I've recently dropped cygwin and use a virtual linux machine instead, but
> haven't tried the virtual linux machine inside Win7 yet.
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Ken Perry
> Sent: 13. mars 2010 20:05
> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: RE: jaws and seven:accessibility, settings, etc.
>
>
>
> Everything does not work out of the box In fact FS is looking into the
> problems I am having with cmd.exe and cygwin and any command line type
> program if you use ssh to get to unix boxes stick with vista and xp right
> now.  That or your going to have to put up with at best a lot of extra
> echoed crap.
>
> Ken
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Øyvind Lode
> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 12:27 PM
> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: RE: jaws and seven:accessibility, settings, etc.
>
> Everything works out of the box.
> I'm running Windows 7 64-bit and JAWS 11.
>
> The only change I've done is to set Windows Explorer to show Details view
> instead of the default tiles.
> Then turn off grouping by going to the view menu and group by and press
> enter on None.
>
> Yep, that's it!
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Tyler
> Littlefield
> Sent: 13. mars 2010 17:04
> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: jaws and seven:accessibility, settings, etc.
>
> Hello all,
> I'm debating putting windows seven on my laptop, and was going to get jaws
> 11. I know in xp there were a few settings that made things work better,
is
> it the same for seven? What sorts of things need to be set for
> accessibility?
>               Thanks,
> Tyler Littlefield
>       http://tds-solutions.net
>       Twitter: sorressean
>
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