Re: ewby on programming need some tips and tricks

  • From: "Octavian Rasnita" <orasnita@xxxxxxxxx>
  • To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 23:25:05 +0200

Well, I would also like to know what Jamal thinks about the friendlyness of Python for the blind. 


Octavian
----- Original Message ----- From: "Tyler Littlefield" <tyler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> 
To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2008 9:01 PM
Subject: Re: ewby on programming need some tips and tricks
um... since when is it not "blind friendly?" Tell jamal that, and nick here too. Unless they've got a switch in the back of their head. If you go take classes somewhere to get certified, you can't just say "it's not blind friendly, so just pass me." 


Thanks,
Tyler Littlefield
email: tyler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
web: tysdomain-com
Visit for quality software and web design.
skype: st8amnd2005
----- Original Message ----- From: "Octavian Rasnita" <orasnita@xxxxxxxxx> 
To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2008 11:52 AM
Subject: Re: ewby on programming need some tips and tricks



I didn't say that the applications made with python are not accessible.
Python might use more libraries for creating the GUI, and if those libraries can create an accessible GUI (like WxPython for example), then those programs created with python will be as accessible as those created with wxWidgets with any other programming language.
What I said was that the programming language is not friendly for the blind, because it forces us to indent the code very strictly, while most other programming languages don't do this. Using indentation is recommended by the sighted programmers because an indented code is much easy to understand visually, but a blind programmer can't see the entire screen and understand the flow of the program, so the indentation is pretty useless.
So we might miss a single space and the program won't compile just because of that.
But just like other languages like VB or ruby, python doesn't use braces for defining blocks, and without beeing able to see the screen entirely, it is hard to jump from the beginning of a block to the end of the block, or to select that block of code, and it is also harder to know if the current line is a new line or if it is just the previous line which is very very long.
With other words, I also don't like python because it forces us to do many things in a single way only, but no doubt, if it would have a syntax like Java, perl or C#, I would have liked them much more. 

Octavian
----- Original Message ----- From: "Nick Stockton" <nstockton@xxxxxxxxx> 
To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2008 8:15 PM
Subject: Re: ewby on programming need some tips and tricks
Hmmm why do you say python is "one of the least friendly programming languages for the blind"? I started learning python a month or so ago and in around a week I had written a program complete with a GUI and install wizard that looks up barcodes on bcscan.com and will automatically speak the output using the jfw and wineyes com objects as well as putting the output in a read-only edit box and automatically setting focus to it so the output can be reviewed with the up and down arrows. I also made a button to pull up the edit page on bcscan.com for the item you scanned in your default web browser so you can add or edit the item info. I also made hotkeys ALT-b to set focus to the barcode entry edit box, ALT-o to set focus to the output and alt-e to activate the add/edit button. All this from me, a python newbie who doesn't know any other programming language in just over a week! And what you might ask is my secret? Three things: The python tutorial at python.org, the speakup screen reader under gnu/linux and my most secret weapon of all... google. 

Nick Stockton
----- Original Message ----- From: "Octavian Rasnita" <orasnita@xxxxxxxxx> 
To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2008 2:58 AM
Subject: Re: ewby on programming need some tips and tricks



No I don't recommend perl if is needed to create that kind of program.
Perl is the best for web apps which are not very simple, and it is also good for desktop apps that require some specific things that can be done using some CPAN modules, because that way the coder won't need to do very low-level programming as he might need to do with languages like Java or python.
If the program is just one that should be used by a single person, and if it doesn't need to be portable, and if it doesn't require very complicated things, I would also recommend C#. I don't like VB.net though. :-)
Anyway, from the perspective of accessibility and responsiveness, the best choice is no doubt C++ with MFC, but it is much harder to create a program with C++/MFC than with DotNet, so DotNet is now prefered.
Of course, Java with SWT could be also a solution, but unfortunately there is no accessible forms designer for the blind for creating programs with SWT like with DotNet.
And python is one of the least friendly programming language for the blind so of course I can't recommend it. 

Octavian
----- Original Message ----- From: "Tyler Littlefield" <tyler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> 
To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2008 4:17 AM
Subject: Re: ewby on programming need some tips and tricks



I would recommend c# or vb.net.
Teddy will no doubt recommend perl, but I think vb.net or c# would be the best for you 


Thanks,
Tyler Littlefield
email: tyler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
web: tysdomain-com
Visit for quality software and web design.
skype: st8amnd2005
----- Original Message ----- From: "Jose Lomeli" <jose.lomeli93@xxxxxxxxxxx> 
To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Thursday, December 04, 2008 11:18 PM
Subject: e: ewby on programming need some tips and tricks
I am thinking of using python or vb6 or any other ones. I want to create a checkings and savings program. Please write back. 
From Jose Lomeli.


----- Original Message -----
From: "Tyler Littlefield" <tyler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Date sent: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 19:04:17 -0700
Subject: Re: ewby on programming need some tips and tricks



hello,
first we need to decide what language your going to use.  any

ideas?

What kind of programs do you want to write?




Thanks,
Tyler Littlefield
email: tyler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
web: tysdomain-com
Visit for quality software and web design.
skype: st8amnd2005



----- Original Message -----
From: "Jose Lomeli" <jose.lomeli93@xxxxxxxxxxx
To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Thursday, December 04, 2008 10:57 PM
Subject: ewby on programming need some tips and tricks




Hello; Listers, I am new to programming and I want to start

doing

this.  What are some tips and tricks I should know about and

what

program do I use for this and where can I download it? Please
write back.
From Jose Lomeli.
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