Now that is a rational angle I had not considered. Unfortunately, Oracle seems to think they bought a cash cow. It is possible they might require paid licences for Java used anywhere. I have not checked the license terms that Sun has placed on this software. I assumed that it was a GPL Open Source type. Does anyone know? It seems kind of strange to change license terms after years and years.
Don MarangThere is just so much stuff in the world that, to me, is devoid of any real substance, value, and content that I just try to make sure that I am working on things that matter.
Dean Kamen -------------------------------------------------- From: "DaShiell, Jude T. CIV NAVAIR 1490, 1, 26" <jude.dashiell@xxxxxxxx> Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 2010 12:45 PM To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Subject: RE: Why isn't Open Office on Windows Accessible?
Well, maybe Oracle can make a case. What I'd like to see the Courts do is to give Oracle a provisional victory such that for as long as Oracle actively supports Android software development they can continue to collect money. When they discontinue support, their time to collect money from Android would also properly end. Now if such a precedent as that were extended to cover the rest of the software industry, I think we would witness the end of the days when titles were being added to the abandonware list. Also, in that way a collection right comes with a software development support responsibility. -----Original Message----- From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Alex Hall Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 2010 12:21 To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: Re: Why isn't Open Office on Windows Accessible? Well, Oracle bought Sun Micro Systems, so they bought Java along with everything else owned by Sun. Now, since Android is written in Java and runs atop a virtual machine, Oracle is trying to say that they are entitled to some of the money made by Android since it is written in a language Oracle now owns. On 8/18/10, katherine Moss <plymouthroamer285@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:Holy moly! What's going on there? What's Oracle suing Google for? From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Don Marang Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 2010 2:38 AM To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: Re: Why isn't Open Office on Windows Accessible? Is all Android app development based on Google's version of Java? Aretherereasonable resources I can point developers to for Androidaccessibilityimplementation? As a potential user / tinkerer, I would like to knowaswell and hopefully be in a better position to provide positivefeedback.Will the threatened Oracle lawsuit of Google over Java damageAndroid'ssuccess? Will it destroy inovation and Open Source if they win? Don Marang There is just so much stuff in the world that, to me, is devoid of anyrealsubstance, value, and content that I just try to make sure that I amworkingon things that matter. Dean Kamen From: Ken Perry <mailto:whistler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Monday, August 16, 2010 7:52 PM To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: RE: Why isn't Open Office on Windows Accessible? This is sort of what Android is doing even if they have not went farenoughyet. They have an accessible event that is thrown by all controlsexceptingstatic and some other problems but at any rate if you use basiccontrols youget the accessible events if however you want to make a custom actionyoucan also throw accessible events that the screen readers like talkback willcatch and speak or the accessibility tools like kick back and soundback cancatch and do something with. So its part developer putting in special access and part developer using the controls that are alreadyaccessible.The unfortunate problem is what you get is only part accessible inmostcases. I am not saying Android is not accessible I am saying whatAndroidis once again proving is if you leave it up to the developer at all usasdevelopers are too lazy to do it. Take me for example if I as a blindcoderwrote a scrabble game I would not think of special cases for highresolutiongraphic cards to have spinning tiles or something to make the gamemoreinteresting for a sited player. I would be shooting for my targetaudience.The reverse is even worse not only are sighted programmers used torapiddevelopment and anything that slows them down out, but they wouldn'tknowwhat we need to have sent to make something accessible unless we pointitout. Here is an example under the Android platform. The defaultmediaplayer has very accessible artist and song lists. But when you openthemthey say nothing for example When you open the media layer you are ona tabscreen and when you arrow left and right it says artist albums andsongs.If you click on artist nothing happens or at least as a blind personhearsit nothing at all happens. If however you are sighted you will noticethata whole list below opens up sort of like a tree but it's more like an expanded list. If you don't know what you're doing and you click onitagain because you thought nothing happened it would close the list.Now asighted coder wouldn't know this is a problem and the current accessframework doesn't take this into account. What should have happened is aopenevent should have been thrown even though focus didn't change thereshouldhave been a notification. Well it would have cost maybe 10 lines acode tomake this work but those lines are not easy to find and if you don'tknow itneeds to be there well you're not going to go looking in the View.javaclassand the accessible_inf_event.java class to figure out how it worksbecauseyou don't know you need to. So how do we fix this? My answer is better thought out tool kits.Once thedevelopers can just use and it will be accessible. If they makeaccustomcontrol then don't do something for accessibility it will error. Willthisever happen. My answer is no but shrug I hope I am wrong. Ken From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of JayMacartySent: Monday, August 16, 2010 1:29 AM To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: Re: Why isn't Open Office on Windows Accessible? One of the ideas I have been toying with for the java screen reader(eitherwe4java or jac) is providing a set of runtime annotations which couldbeused to enhance an application's accessibility by allowing the appdeveloperto put in self voicing annotations. There are differing schools ofthoughton self voicing. Some say it is good because the developer knows theappbest and where self voicing would be helpful. On the other hand,putting inself voicing without providing the user a way of controling it orturningoff certain levels of it, takes away from the user's control over the accessibility feedback. If we put self voicing annotations into thejavascreen reader, a developer could add them in if desired but the basescreenreader code base would still have control and could provide a common mechanism for allowing the user to adjust the self voicing feedback. ----- Original Message ----- From: Ken Perry <mailto:whistler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Sent: Friday, August 13, 2010 5:20 PM Subject: RE: Why isn't Open Office on Windows Accessible? I agree with Chris H.'s answer but I want to point out it's our faultit'snot already accessible. I wrote a simple talking java screen readerthatdid very little but it made it so I could use Open Office. Crappilybut thebuttons talked and all and I did this in like 200 lines of code. Iknowthat code got passed around and I have since lost my copy but it canbedone by replacing the access bridge with self voicing code. It justtakessomeone actually doing it. I am interested to see where Open Office goes now that it is Oricals.I amworried about all Java stuff now that Orical is trying to Sew Googleintostopping Android. It's a crazy world. Ken From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of KerneelsRoosSent: Friday, August 13, 2010 3:30 AM To: programmingblind Subject: Why isn't Open Office on Windows Accessible? Hi List, Sorry if this question has been raised before and dealt with. Doesanyoneknow exactly why the Windows version of Open Office is only partly accessible with a screen reader, while the Linux version is streetsahead?Because Open Office is written in Java I assume the code base is 98% identical across platforms. Is the problem mainly with the JAB (JavaAccessBridge) or with the screen readers themselves? Could the JAB not beopensourced so it can be updated to bridge Java, MSAA, UIA and any otheraccessmiddle ware standard? NVDA works the best with Open Office, so I would assume it makes thebestuse of the JAB. Is there other Java to access technology middle wareincommon use today? I can remember a really long thread that in part had some info on Java accessibility, but I just can't justify going through all that topossiblyfind out more. Keep well -- Kerneels Roos Cell/SMS: +27 (0)82 309 1998 Skype: cornelis.roos The early bird may get the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese! __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virussignaturedatabase 5376 (20100818) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com-- Have a great day, Alex (msg sent from GMail website) mehgcap@xxxxxxxxx; http://www.facebook.com/mehgcap __________ View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind __________ View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
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