Re: Seeking someone to compile 32-bit version of NFBTrans
- From: "John J. Boyer" <john.boyer@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2010 12:10:14 -0500
Jamal,
I'm glad you are having better luck with xml2brl Perhaps I will change
the name in future releases to indicate that it is not limited to xml
input files.
Please note that much more attention has been given to fowrard
translation than to back-translation. If you trranslate a text or xml
file you will see that it is not only translated properly but also
formatted properly. Try this on a Daisy xml file from Bookshare. This
applies to xml2brl NOT to lou_translate
liblouisxml is now slated for bug fixes only. Work will move to
liblouisutdml project page http://code.google.com/p/liblouisutdml This
is because it incorporates the Unified Tactile Ducyment Markup Language
(UTDML), which gives the capacity to provide all the computational
resources needed for braille transcription, including dividing a book
into volumes.
Many of the current liblouis tables for languages and braille codes
other than the O.S. one give horrible back translations. This will be
fixed as part of the BrailleBlaster project.
Now to your questions.
xml2brl uses liblouisxml.dll libxml2.dll and liblouis-2.dll
I don't know why you are having a problem with line endings. I've
noticed something also and need to look into it. However, any fix will
go into the repository. We have to solve the linking problem before we
can get the latest release of liblouisxml as a Windows binary. It is
easy to compile the dll's with Microsoft compilers, however.
The problem with double quotes in the leader loines in the table of
contents is with the translation table. It can be fixed, perhaps by
using the noback opcode prefix.
Let me know if you have more questionns.
John
On Sat, Jul 31, 2010 at 12:20:46PM -0400, Jamal Mazrui wrote:
> John,
> You are right -- xml2brl.exe did find the relevant table(s). I
> mistakenly thought it required the tables to be copied into the same
> directory as the executable, as is the case with lou_translate.exe,
> which does not find the en-us-g2.ctb table otherwise.
>
> Everything else I noted below still applies, so please answer the
> questions I posed when you get a chance.
>
> Jamal
>
>
> On 7/31/2010 11:18 AM, John J. Boyer wrote:
> >Jamal,
> >
> >What command line did you use? You shouldn't need to specify the
> >translation table. Try
> >xml2brl -b founding.brf founding.txt
> >
> >What output does this line give?
> >
> >In the directory in which you unzipped the binary try
> >bin/xml2brl -b founding.brf founding.txt
> >
> >Please let me know the results.
> >
> >Thanks,
> >John
> >
> >On Sat, Jul 31, 2010 at 10:33:14AM -0400, Jamal Mazrui wrote:
> >>I mistakenly assumed that xml2brl.exe required an input file in XML
> >>format. Here are my results now:
> >>
> >>* The translation table is not found when a binary is run from the bin
> >>directory.
> >>
> >>* I did find the translation tables in a subdirectory of the shared
> >>directory.
> >>
> >>* Just copying en-us-g2.ctb, the file specified on the command line in
> >>my example, does not work. Evidently, other files are needed as well.
> >>After copying all files in the tables subdirectory, the binary ram
> >>without error messages.
> >>
> >>* The conversion with xml2brf.exe did back translate better than
> >>lou_translate.exe. In terms of character translation errors, the only
> >>thing I notice is that a series of double quotes appears in each line of
> >>the table of contents between the section name and page number.
> >>NFBTrans uses periods instead, which I think is correct. For example,
> >>
> >>Preamble .............. 13
> >>
> >>as opposed to
> >>
> >>Preamble """""""""""""" 13
> >>
> >>I regard this as minor since the table of contents only appears at the
> >>beginning of a document.
> >>
> >>* Oddly, line endings were better in EdSharp with the output from
> >>lou_translate. xml2brl had no line endings -- lines just ran together.
> >> When I opened the same file in Notepad, however, line endings were
> >>correct, so I think that is an EdSharp problem, which I am investigating.
> >>
> >>So, this is a definite improvement. A few questions are as follows:
> >>
> >>* What specific files are needed for an English back translation in
> >>addition to en-us-g2.ctb?
> >>
> >>* What .dll files are needed for xml2brl.exe to work? (I notice several
> >>in the bin directory and want to copy only what is needed.)
> >>
> >>* Do you have any idea why I am not getting line endings in EdSharp,
> >>even though it is recognizing the file as UTF-8?
> >>
> >>Thanks,
> >>Jamal
> >>
> >>On 7/30/2010 5:24 PM, John J. Boyer wrote:
> >>>Jamal,
> >>>
> >>>The translation tables should be in the Windows binary. In fact they
> >>>should be found automatically. To get good results, use the xml2brl
> >>>program rather than the liblouis test programs. for example:
> >>>xml2brl -b founding.brf founding.txt
> >>>
> >>>xml2brl uses liblouisxml with built-in configuration files to get good
> >>>formatted braille. Formatting anc translation can be changed by
> >>>specifying a configuration file with the -f option.
> >>>
> >>>Let me know if you have more questionsj.
> >>>
> >>>John
> >>>
> >>>On Fri, Jul 30, 2010 at 04:48:19PM -0400, Jamal Mazrui wrote:
> >>>>Thanks, John. That Windows distribution did not seem to include
> >>>>translation tables, so should I use those in the tables subdirectory of
> >>>>the latest liblouis distribution? I tried that and it seemed to work
> >>>>except for an unexpected amount of garbage characters when I back
> >>>>translated a file as compared to NFBTrans. I may not be using the
> >>>>optimum
> >>>>techniques, however, so would appreciate any tips.
> >>>>
> >>>>Specifically, I downloaded the free .brf file containing the Declaration
> >>>>of Independence and Constitution from the National Braille Press page at
> >>>>
> >>>>http://www.nbp.org/ic/nbp/publications/downloads.html
> >>>>
> >>>>Since it has an abbreviated file name that is hard to remember, I
> >>>>renamed it to founding.brf. I then back translated with the following
> >>>>command:
> >>>>
> >>>>lou_translate.exe -b en-us-g2.ctb<founding.brf>founding.txt
> >>>>
> >>>>If you want to compare output with NFBTrans, use Control+Shift+O in
> >>>>EdSharp. I did some fine tuning of parameters in the call to NFBTrans
> >>>>via a configuration file, but it's been long enough that I do not recall
> >>>>what.
> >>>>
> >>>>By the way, the Windows binaries get unarchived into a 2.0 subdirectory
> >>>>whereas the latest liblouis seems to be 1.8. Can you clarify?
> >>>>
> >>>>Jamal
> >>>>On Fri, 30
> >>>>Jul 2010, John J. Boyer wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>>Date: Fri, 30 Jul 2010 14:32:13 -0500
> >>>>>From: John J. Boyer<john.boyer@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >>>>>Reply-To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >>>>>To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >>>>>Subject: Re: Seeking someone to compile 32-bit version of NFBTrans
> >>>>>
> >>>>>There is a version of liblouis and liblouisxml for Windows. Look on the
> >>>>>downloads page of http://www.abilitiessoft.com It is not the most
> >>>>>recent
> >>>>>version, but it will do most things. It does not depend on Cygwin. It
> >>>>>was compiled using a combination of MinGW and msys. There was a problem
> >>>>>linking the most recent version, which we hope to overcome. The new
> >>>>>project, BrailleBlaster, will work on Windows, Mac and Linux.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>John
> >>>>>
> >>>>>On Fri, Jul 30, 2010 at 01:35:13PM -0400, Jamal Mazrui wrote:
> >>>>>>Yes, the Unicode and multi-language support would be advantages over
> >>>>>>NFBTrans. For English users, those features may not matter. Based
> >>>>>>on a
> >>>>>>Google search on
> >>>>>>liblouis windows
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>compiling on Windows has not been successful so far, even with cygwin,
> >>>>>>which I would not want the executable to depend on.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>Jamal
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>On Fri, 30 Jul 2010,
> >>>>>>Ken Perry wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Date: Fri, 30 Jul 2010 12:54:49 -0400
> >>>>>>>From: Ken Perry<whistler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >>>>>>>Reply-To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >>>>>>>To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >>>>>>>Subject: RE: Seeking someone to compile 32-bit version of NFBTrans
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>It will compile on windows they are trying to get someone to make a
> >>>>>>>windows
> >>>>>>>release of it. It would compile quite easy if someone wanted to do
> >>>>>>>it.
> >>>>>>>Much easier Than NFBtrans. In fact it probably has a lot more good
> >>>>>>>stuff
> >>>>>>>than NFZBtrans. For example uni code support and multiple language
> >>>>>>>support.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Ken
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>-----Original Message-----
> >>>>>>>From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >>>>>>>[mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Jamal
> >>>>>>>Mazrui
> >>>>>>>Sent: Friday, July 30, 2010 11:39 AM
> >>>>>>>To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >>>>>>>Subject: RE: Seeking someone to compile 32-bit version of NFBTrans
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>liblouis is a good project, but in the latest distribution from
> >>>>>>>http://code.google.com/p/liblouis/
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>I could not find any executable that runs on Windows. The
> >>>>>>>documentation
> >>>>>>>mentions a Windows DLL, but that is not included in the distribution
> >>>>>>>either, nor is there documentation about how to use it. In general,
> >>>>>>>the
> >>>>>>>project appears to be Linux-oriented. Also, there are Python
> >>>>>>>bindings,
> >>>>>>>but they do not include support for the back translation part of the
> >>>>>>>liblouis API (going from a .brf string to plain text).
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>For these reasons, I used NFBTrans as a converter in EdSharp, and am
> >>>>>>>now
> >>>>>>>hoping that I can get a version that runs on Win64 (by compiling it
> >>>>>>>as
> >>>>>>>32-bit rather than 16-bit).
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>If any C programmers can use the liblouis source code to create a
> >>>>>>>32-bit
> >>>>>>>Windows executable, including back translation support, please go for
> >>>>>>>it
> >>>>>>>and share your results. Such a translator would probably be better
> >>>>>>>than
> >>>>>>>NFBTrans, but since the latter already existed as a 16-bit Windows
> >>>>>>>executable, I thought it may be easier for voluntary C programmers to
> >>>>>>>start from there.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Jamal
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>On Fri, 30 Jul 2010, Ken Perry wrote:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>Date: Fri, 30 Jul 2010 11:03:45 -0400
> >>>>>>>>From: Ken Perry<whistler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >>>>>>>>Reply-To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >>>>>>>>To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >>>>>>>>Subject: RE: Seeking someone to compile 32-bit version of NFBTrans
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>Is there a reason your going back to an old bit of source when
> >>>>>>>>Liblouis
> >>>>>>>>is
> >>>>>>>>maintained so well?
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>Ken
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>-----Original Message-----
> >>>>>>>>From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >>>>>>>>[mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Jamal
> >>>>>>>>Mazrui
> >>>>>>>>Sent: Friday, July 30, 2010 7:22 AM
> >>>>>>>>To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >>>>>>>>Cc: Arthur Pirika
> >>>>>>>>Subject: Re: Seeking someone to compile 32-bit version of NFBTrans
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>Cool -- thanks for working on this. Hopefully, the result can be a
> >>>>>>>>better NFBTrans, not just a 32-bit compatible one.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>Jamal
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>On 7/30/2010 7:02 AM, Arthur Pirika wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>I've also taken a look at this code, and while it does seem pretty
> >>>>>>>>>portable, the only part that looked fishy at first was an asm file,
> >>>>>>>>>but
> >>>>>>>>>all it does is pc speaker sound output.
> >>>>>>>>>However, the code's a wash with #defines, #ifdef DOS's and unixes,
> >>>>>>>>>djgpp's, etc. Also, for instance, it sets some hard limits on path
> >>>>>>>>>lengths. 127 if it's dos, and 1024 if it's unix. Btw, I'm looking
> >>>>>>>>>into
> >>>>>>>>>this with open watcom, using it's win32 compilers.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>Just some thoughts,
> >>>>>>>>>Arthur.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>----- Original Message ----- From: "Jamal
> >>>>>>>>>Mazrui"<empower@xxxxxxxxx>
> >>>>>>>>>To:<programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >>>>>>>>>Cc: "Joseph Lee"<joseph.lee22590@xxxxxxxxx>
> >>>>>>>>>Sent: Friday, July 30, 2010 10:38 PM
> >>>>>>>>>Subject: Re: Seeking someone to compile 32-bit version of NFBTrans
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>Thanks. Please share any notes from your efforts. If you run into
> >>>>>>>>>>a
> >>>>>>>>>>problem and report it here, someone else may be able to help.
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>Jamal
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>On 7/29/2010 10:32 AM, Joseph Lee wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>Hi,
> >>>>>>>>>>>I'll try it via VS2008 (I have 32-bit machine).
> >>>>>>>>>>>Cheers,
> >>>>>>>>>>>Joseph
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>-----Original Message-----
> >>>>>>>>>>>From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >>>>>>>>>>>[mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Jamal
> >>>>>>>Mazrui
> >>>>>>>>>>>Sent: Thursday, July 29, 2010 4:33 AM
> >>>>>>>>>>>To: programmingblind
> >>>>>>>>>>>Subject: Seeking someone to compile 32-bit version of NFBTrans
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>NFBTrans is a free, open source braille translator available at
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>http://www.nfb.org/nfb/nfbtrans.asp
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>The last version released is a 16-bit process, so will not run on
> >>>>>>>64-bit
> >>>>>>>>>>>Windows. I am looking for a C programmer who can compile a 32-bit
> >>>>>>>>>>>version using the included source code. The distribution does
> >>>>>>>>>>>include
> >>>>>>>>>>>make files for Unix-like systems, so my hope is that the code is
> >>>>>>>written
> >>>>>>>>>>>in a portable enough manner that a skilled C programmer would be
> >>>>>>>>>>>able
> >>>>>>>to
> >>>>>>>>>>>recompile it for platforms of today without much difficulty.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>Can anyone do this via MinGW, or if not, with another C
> >>>>>>>>>>>compiler? I
> >>>>>>>>>>>would gladly post an updated distribution for anyone to use
> >>>>>>>>>>>freely.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>As an option in the Open Other Format command, Control+Shift+O,
> >>>>>>>>>>>EdSharp
> >>>>>>>>>>>uses the existing NFBTrans for back translation of .brf or .brl
> >>>>>>>>>>>files
> >>>>>>>>>>>into plain text (e.g., books downloaded from BookShare or NLS).
> >>>>>>>>>>>This
> >>>>>>>>>>>does not work on Win64, however.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>Jamal
> >>>>>>>>>>>__________
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> >>>>>--
> >>>>>John J. Boyer; President, Chief Software Developer
> >>>>>Abilitiessoft, Inc.
> >>>>>http://www.abilitiessoft.com
> >>>>>Madison, Wisconsin USA
> >>>>>Developing software for people with disabilities
> >>>>>
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> >
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http://www.abilitiessoft.com
Madison, Wisconsin USA
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