RE: Searching for blind programmer to start a school for blind programmers
- From: "Ken Perry" <whistler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Fri, 8 Apr 2011 21:35:51 -0400
Oh come now you should at least expect 60 hours of volunteer time from me
and, the requirement that I found my own way back to law school so I can
volunteer as the firms lawyer as well.
Ken
-----Original Message-----
From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of RicksPlace
Sent: Friday, April 08, 2011 1:51 PM
To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: Searching for blind programmer to start a school for blind
programmers
Hi Ken: If I am hired I would expect you to do your part and volunteer at
least 40 hours per week to help me get the project off the ground.
All the other Experts should do the same. I want a top level professional
staff but can't pay you anything.Also, if you know of a good Law firm to set
up the Corporation and handle the necessary Government contracting and
Taxation processing for free let me know. The last two things would be a
free CPA Firm to handle the necessary regulatory paperwork and the
accounting for the company. Oh, ya, their may be some small business
expenses related to hiring the necessary folks to get accreditation with the
governing body for such things and hfinding folks to handle grant
applications as well.
need my $10, 000 per month or I would be glad to do it for free so long as
the folks who are going to own the corporation poney up for all the legal
and Business related costs along with my salary.
If I pull this off I am sure you and Sina and the other Pros would agree I
would deserve my salary plus a very, very nice Golden Parachute if I have to
leav for any reason - there is always the outside possibility they might
fire me and I would need a cool Mill or so to help keep my feelings from
being hurt too much.
Thanks for your support Ken and I look forward to being your boss - so long
as you don't charge anything and help get other Pros to do the same.
OK, kind of a dumb idea perhaps considering the likely available resources
of the folks requesting this service.
For real, a tutor service using one of the existing Chat Rooms would be a
real help I believe to University students around the Country.
Volunteers could set times they would be available online to discuss their
work if there were any interested students who needed our help.
Later and, if you really want to do this I would give you a discount,
perhaps 10% off?
Even though I am kidding a little, you work in the business and my numbers
are actually not that far off for those real world job skills if you were to
contract them out.
Later:
Rick
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ken Perry" <whistler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Friday, April 08, 2011 9:59 AM
Subject: RE: Searching for blind programmer to start a school for blind
programmers
Wow and I thought my replies were fun.
-----Original Message-----
From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of RicksPlace
Sent: Friday, April 08, 2011 9:30 AM
To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: Searching for blind programmer to start a school for blind
programmers
Hay Guys: I decided to head up this project. OK, so we could have a online
classroom with various subjects being taught and Expert Tutors available on
call for students anytime.
Now, this will be a large project which will likely take a year to implement
fully with the necessary Business, Government and Technical arena processes
needing a goodly amount of professional action.
I figure that one year of work providing this level of Expertise including
registering any free Tutors and setting everything up is around a 6 figure
job. Let me know if you are interested in getting started right away. i will
accept either a monthy salary or weekly or even bi-weekly - whichever is
most affordable to you. You will also be required to pick up the costs
involved to provide any Legal or Business related expenses, technical
training for staff and any hardware and software necessary to get the first
year's project implemented.
We can set up the results as a modular structure based on completed modules
over a specific timeframe during which time you can fire me at any time if I
do not meet projections.
I have other commitments just now but if you have say $25,000 available for
some legal fees and business related expenses as well as some initial
hardware and software we can get started with developing the Business Plan
for your organization as soon as you cut me my first check.
If you want the total year's projected cost structure along with my salary
requirements, you can send me my first month's retainer of $10,000 and I
will contact you to set up a Business Plan based on your requirements.
Later:
Rick USA
Rick USA
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jared Wright" <wright.jaredm@xxxxxxxxx>
To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Friday, April 08, 2011 8:50 AM
Subject: Re: Searching for blind programmer to start a school for blind
programmers
> Some reasoning to support this would be helpful. Absolutely no disrespect
> meant, but you do not seem to be in the workplace in a typical software
> development capacity given your fairly rudimentary questions on the list
> about modern programming concepts. That really is not meant as a
> criticism, please do not take it as such. Also please correct me if my
> observations have lead me to the wrong conclusion. But
> usability/accessibility analysis and mainstream software engineering are
> like steak and potatoes. Both play an important role in a great meal but
> are very different in their preparation. so some additional context for
> why you feel a separatist educational environment for programming would be
> beneficial would help me understand why you take the position you do.
> On 4/8/2011 7:26 AM, Homme, James wrote:
>> Hi,
>> As someone already in the work place, I think it would be a good thing.
>>
>> Jim
>>
>> Jim Homme,
>> Usability Services,
>> Phone: 412-544-1810. Skype: jim.homme
>> Highmark recipients, Read my accessibility blog. Discuss accessibility
>> here. Accessibility Wiki: Breaking news and accessibility advice
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Jared Wright
>> Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2011 4:29 PM
>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Subject: Re: Searching for blind programmer to start a school for blind
>> programmers
>>
>> I also am inclined to agree with this. I'm just finished with school and
>> haven't gotten to see first hand just how much of an impact it will have
>> in the workforce, I admit, but I know I learned a lot about not just
>> programming but about working smoothly on a development team otherwise
>> made up of sighted developers by going to a "normal" university for
>> CompSci. My fear would be that in a special environment for blind
>> programming instruction all the tools used for class would be the most
>> accessible ones available. Then a student would get into the work force
>> with an employer who doesn't use those ideal accessible tools and the
>> student would be ill-equipped to problem solve this challenge. I think
>> having a vibrant, active community of blind coders working on things
>> like nonvisualdevelopment.org and contributing to forums like this one
>> is a great way to help address the unique challenges of being a blind
>> coder, but in the grand scheme of things I feel I spend about 10% of my
>> time devoted to programming and related pursuits finding blind-friendly
>> ways of using tools or environments. The other 90% is the same process
>> of learning programming that my sighted peers take on. I also do think
>> there would be issues with many employers disregarding or harboring
>> skepticism of applicants who listed a specialized school for blind
>> people on a resumé. Still, a good idea to kick around and get a variety
>> of prospectives on.
>> On 4/7/2011 3:23 PM, Sina Bahram wrote:
>>> I agree with this as well.
>>>
>>> Take care,
>>> Sina
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Ken Perry
>>> Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2011 1:08 PM
>>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> Subject: RE: Searching for blind programmer to start a school for blind
>>> programmers
>>>
>>> I have to say this even though I think there is a place for what you're
>>> thinking of.
>>>
>>> I hate sepertive schools. One of the things that made me a good
>>> programmer
>>> was competing against the people I would be competing against in the
>>> work
>>> world In the academic world.
>>>
>>> The salt Lake community college had a class run by novel that taught
>>> blind
>>> people to code for Novel OS but I found the students that came out of
>>> their
>>> knew a single thing and not very well.
>>>
>>> Now with that said if the standards are high enough a school like this
>>> could
>>> be a good benefit but you have to be careful not to dumb down both the
>>> speed
>>> of learning or quality thereof. Of course that is true for all schools.
>>>
>>> One last thing though that the regular schools taught me. That is part
>>> of
>>> life as a blind coder is finding ways to cope with problems that you run
>>> into. If you have things handed to you, you might not be as affective
>>> when
>>> you get out in the work world.
>>>
>>> Ken
>>>
>>> Ken
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Bill Cox
>>> Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2011 12:03 PM
>>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> Subject: Searching for blind programmer to start a school for blind
>>> programmers
>>>
>>> This is still in the dumb-idea phase, and I don't have any funding
>>> lined up to get this started. That said...
>>>
>>> I have not been able to find any on-line school for teaching blind
>>> people to become professional programmers. I feel the world needs
>>> such an organization. I am not able to start such a school myself,
>>> but I would be interested in assisting social entrepreneurs in
>>> starting such a venture. I it would best be implemented as a
>>> for-profit social entrepreneurial venture. You can read about social
>>> entrepreneurs here:
>>>
>>> http://www.ashoka.org/social_entrepreneur
>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_entrepreneurship
>>>
>>> I'm thinking it could be a Low Profit Corporation (LPC) founded to run
>>> the school for a profit. Everyone hired in teaching or management
>>> would be vision impaired or blind. Students would attend classes
>>> on-line, and could be anywhere in the world. Classes would not be
>>> free (maybe $1,000 per 1-semester course?). Students who are too poor
>>> to pay would be expected to do well in their courses and make up their
>>> fees by assisting teaching of those courses in later semesters. They
>>> might also be required to work for an associated consulting company to
>>> earn tuition. Students would be encouraged to help mentor each other
>>> in any case.
>>>
>>> Associated with the school could be a software consulting services
>>> company. The company would only hire vision impaired programmers, and
>>> students wanting to work for the company could take classes designed
>>> to train them in the skills they'll need. The company might encourage
>>> it's employees to spend one day a week on FOSS projects of their
>>> interest, which hopefully would include improving accessibility.
>>>
>>> Rough numbers to back up the idea: There are around 15 million people
>>> with "severe" vision impairments in the US. Roughly half of those
>>> people are too old. Half of the rest may have other impairments that
>>> would prevent them from becoming programmers. In the general
>>> population, there are 1 programmer out of every 500 people in the US.
>>> I would expect a ratio at least that high among the blind, or about
>>> 7,500 professional programmers in the US alone. If we took 20 years
>>> to train that many, it'd be 375 new students per year, and assuming a
>>> two year program, we'd have 750 students. If only half paid the class
>>> fees, but took three classes at a time (a full load), that'd be
>>> $3,000*750*2 = $4.5 million per year. My kids go to a school which
>>> happens to have about 750 students and a budget of just over $4
>>> million per year, and that includes paying for a school. So, that
>>> math seems to work out, but we're not talking about anyone making a
>>> billion dollars in this effort. This is not a VC-fundable idea, but
>>> it might attract funding from groups that invest in socially
>>> beneficial startups.
>>>
>>> I know a couple of good candidates to start this school, and one might
>>> be interested in actually doing it. Are there any good blind or
>>> vision impaired people you guys could recommend for me to talk to? I
>>> think the key would be finding the right couple of guys.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Bill
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