Re: Screen Reader Compatibility

  • From: Jared Wright <wright.jaredm@xxxxxxxxx>
  • To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
  • Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2010 11:40:50 -0500

This is not something I am effected by and thus have not explored in depth, but this appears to indicate that you can in fact customize the Braille tables however you would like. 1/24/2010 10:44 AM, coscell wrote:

WE couldn't be modified the braille table so it doesn't support Asia
language like Chinese.

On Sun, 24 Jan 2010, Jared Wright wrote:

1. Window Eyes has a self-contained Eloquence driver now that is equal to
JFW's in every way.
2. Who cares who had scripting back in 1998?  It's now 2010, friend, and WE
took the time to do there's right, and thus you have a scripting environment
that uses programming languages we already use rather than than proprietary
garbage, adheres to better common programming practices, and supports COM
automation (which is truly a beautiful thing.)
3. The JAWS SMA authorizes only two upgrades, while WE's authorizes three.
4. JAWS requires an additional $200 for remote desktop access. Window Eyes
does not, making the pricing difference even more clear.
5. If you insist on cracking, Window Eyes is an easier crack than JFW.

Normally I wouldn't care, but so many projects, like Sodbeans, seem to juse
jump on the JAWS bandwagon by default. This perception needs to change,
because I think you can make a pretty convincing case that JFW is pretty
definitively inferior to Window Eyes. The only things JAWS users can give me
for why they don't switch is that they are stubborn and do not want to learn
the WE interface. I mean, , JAWS 11 is loaded with ugly regressions.  Couple
this with some of Freedom's political and legal jockeying over the last few
years, and I think it's clear that they do not want to see AT improve at as
rapid a pace as possible. They just want to make a dollar off blind people who
are struggling for that dollar as it is. That isn't to say the folks at GW
Micro aren't trying to make a living, but FS in my opinion has reached the
point of being downright sleezy. Maybe that doesn't matter to you, but it does
to me.


On 1/24/2010 4:41 AM, black ares wrote:
man, in time I've started using jaws, in our part of world, windows eyes
mean nothing.
More years after, (10 or so) window eyes was poor in features, worked in
less situations than jaws.
Look at the scripting feature you claim here.
In what year did windows eyes introduced scripting? How I remember, some two
or three years ago, man, jaws had scripting still from 1998 (as farr as I
know), because in 1998 I started using a pc and also jaws for windows and
surprisingly hal5 for dos.

Also, I will speak here about a practice that make you all to be ofenced
acting in law supporters, but on the other side, is a practice which gives
help to marketing.
And if you don't guess what is about I will tell you, is about cracks.
In early life, when I had no money to buy such expensive licenses (in my
country medium sallary is around 500 euro even now), I found jaws cracks and
used jaws with crack from 1998 til 2006 during my high school studies and
after during my university studies.
After, when I've got employed and begun making money with help of screen
readers as a software developer, what screen reader license do you think I
have bought?
Sure the one I was used to.
I had a fairly great experience with jaws and even not thought to spent 900
dolars to a new software, at that time with less features than jaws, and to
spent time to learn it.

More than that, I am looking now at your pricing plan there
and it is true window eyes is 895 dolars and jaws is 1095 dolars so 200
dolars difference, but jaws sma is 200 dolars and windows eyes is 300
so in time, you get all money back and is no difference between the two
The only thing that difers is the marketing plan and for sure the product
and unfortunately for you, freedom scientific are better both.

Other things which keeped me away from window eyes:
1. the synth, I realy love elocuence and that delktalk and how the hell is
called and spelled, is very lazy and sounds poorly compared to elocuence.
Window eyes introducet elocuence after 2002 and not as a default synth and
when, in 2006 I wanted to give a try to window eyes, I ended up not
understanding the dectalk even for succeeding to change it in elocuence... I
gave up.
2. also the keyboard differences from jaws which put me in a new environment
where I don't know how to get the informations I wanted to, scared me.
3. lacs of come crack, for permeting me to evaluate best the software, until
2007 I didn't see any cracks for window eyes and how I remember (may be I am
wrong) in demo mode window eyes, in its early stages acted only for 10

So, what you see now man, is the results of a wrong marketing campain that
gwmicro have done during years.
For a product, the product it self and a low price is not enough to sell the
In this moment, even you will offer the window eyes for free, you will not
get so rapidly customers, because there are true alternatives there like
best regards my friend and think better, the software market does not mean
only good technics developed in a software.
Radu Vasile
Project manager and software architect
Cell: +40722614784
----- Original Message ----- From: "Jared Wright"<wright.jaredm@xxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Saturday, January 23, 2010 10:16 PM
Subject: Re: Screen Reader Compatibility

I'm definitely disappointed to see JAWS getting all the attention on the
Windows side. Personal, subjective preference aside, I think most of us
can agree that It's more expensive than Window Eyes, has an inferior
scripting implementation compared to Window Eyes, uses more system
resources than Window Eyes, and yet so many accessibility products worry
about compatibility with JFW which translates to implicit support for
Freedom Scientific's frivolous litigation, forced Braille driver signing,
and other nonsense that serves the blind community in no useful fashion.
It sounds like you've already gotten pretty far on your roadmap for
Windows with JAWS already, so I'll say no more. Hopefully you'll revisit
the possibility of Window Eyes compatibility in the future, although I
guess with Window Eyes being more adaptable (my opinion of course) it'll
be easier for its users to adapt it to Sotbeans themselves.


On 1/23/2010 9:59 AM, Andreas Stefik wrote:
Hi folks,

We're working hard out here on screen reader compatibility on the
Sappy/Sodbeans projects in NetBeans. We're trying to decide which screen
readers we should make our code compatible with. We realistically can't
do all of them in the short term and we are starting with Jaws/ OSX
Voice Over. Once those are complete, any suggestions on what screen
readers the community would prefer come next? Any preferences?

We were thinking maybe a unix flavor screen reader, perhaps Orca, but
are open to suggestions. What does the community think?

Andreas Stefik, Ph.D.
Assistant Professor
Department of Computer Science
Southern Illinois University Edwardsville
View the list's information and change your settings at

View the list's information and change your settings at

View the list's information and change your settings at

View the list's information and change your settings at

View the list's information and change your settings at

Other related posts: