RE: Methods for Correcting a Problem in educational institutes, wasRe: Story Boards

  • From: "Sina Bahram" <sbahram@xxxxxxxxx>
  • To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2007 17:19:00 -0400

As a graduate student in computer science: trust me, I know.

Take care,
Sina
 

-----Original Message-----
From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of inthaneelf
Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2007 4:59 PM
To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Methods for Correcting a Problem in educational institutes, wasRe:
Story Boards

ah, Sina, by Marvin's own statements, its still going on in "today's world" 
as you put it...

inthane
. For Blind Programming assistance, Information, Useful Programs, and Links
to Jamal Mazrui's Text tutorial packages and Applications, visit me at:
http://grabbag.alacorncomputer.com
. to be able to view a simple programming project in several programming
languages, visit the Fruit basket demo site at:
http://fruitbasketdemo.alacorncomputer.com

----- Original Message -----
From: "Sina Bahram" <sbahram@xxxxxxxxx>
To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2007 8:31 AM
Subject: RE: Story Boards


> While your message is quite informative and somewhat colorful, it offers
> very little in the way of facts.
>
> I admire your passion about the subject, and I sympathise with your level 
> of
> complete and utter removal from the issues in today's world.
>
> Take care,
> Sina
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Chris 
> Hofstader
> Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2007 11:08 AM
> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: RE: Story Boards
>
> Sina,
>
> If you remember, I went to college well before the ADA, 508 and the 
> related
> state regulations.  NYU had no office of disability affairs and when I 
> asked
> the CS department to provide me with a new ribbon for the punch card 
> typing
> things so I could read my Fortran programs with the higher contrast 
> afforded
> by actually having a decent amount of ink in the machine, I was refused 
> and
> had to go to a stationary store and buy my own and had to change the 
> ribbon
> every time I wanted to change my programs.
>
> As a low vision student I had to take chemistry in a department that would
> not let me skip the highly visual tasks like finding chemical signatures 
> by
> the portion of the spectrum they excite  so I had to let my lab partner do
> the looking and pretend that I had seen those colors myself.  Physics was 
> a
> real ball in a poorly lit lab where, even more than in chemistry, I had to
> rely on a partner to do all of the looking for me and had to assume she 
> was
> right.
>
> Life in pre-ADA universities was just a barrel of monkeys - a laugh a 
> minute
> - a real party for BLV students.  I got really good grades but without the
> value of an indifferent university administration or faculty but with a 
> lot
> of help from fellow students who pitched in because people who want to 
> live
> in Greenwich Village tend to be pretty nice.  There is a reason I don't 
> even
> include my degree from NYU on my resume as they did squat for me and I did
> most of my learning as an autodidact.
>
> I would not want to hear about students in the era after the passage of 
> ADA
> and other laws having to go through the shit I had to 25 years ago.  Until
> we can assume that accessibility will be provided automatically, without
> special negotiations with cement headed professors and even stupider
> administrators, we are riding in the back of the bus.
>
> cdh
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Sina Bahram
> Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2007 9:37 AM
> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: RE: Story Boards
>
> Wouldn't want to go about it in a sensible way, would we?
>
> 100 times out of 100, I have found the DSS office, and not the professor, 
> to
> be the most ignorant of both the intention, and even the letter of, ADA,
> 508, etc. This can be likened to Microsoft caring more about accessibility
> than the AT companies, for example.
>
> I think that a lot of these situations can be resolved by simply talking 
> to
> the professor in their office hours or on the phone and explaining the
> process by which you can translate your internal knowledge into external
> representations of that knowledge. Discussions involving lawyers tend to 
> be
> counterproductive at best, and costly over an amazing amount of time, at
> worst. Not to mention, you are simply feeding the already ridiculous
> stereotype that all blind folks are going to sue you if you do even one
> thing wrong. This is an unhealthy, unproductive, and amazingly all around
> bad idea.
>
> The entirety of Chris's technical suggestions were quite excellent; 
> however,
> and I urge you to follow them.
>
> Good luck
>
> Take care,
> Sina
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Chris 
> Hofstader
> Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2007 8:38 AM
> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: RE: Story Boards
>
>
> Hi Marvin,
>
> Drawing tools have taken a back seat in the development priorities at the
> commercial AT companies.  We had a contractor (Will Pearson) working on a
> audio version of Visio that used 3D sound for us at FS a bunch of years 
> ago.
> When I moved on, FS shit canned Will and killed the project.
>
> One way to story board a project would be to make your "slides" using html
> itself.  The pages you make will not be fully functional but, rather,
> describe the contents of the page when it is finally completed.  This will
> provide a set of pages that your instructor can view in any order that he
> prefers and will contain all of the information you need to use to develop
> the stories for your ultimate project.
>
> Another approach would be to do it using the MS Word Outline mode
> (View/Outline in Word 2003, I haven't used it in 2007 yet so I can't tell
> you how to get it in that version).  The Word outliner creates kind of a
> tree view of information which can be up to 12 (I think) levels deep.  The
> person reading the document can set the depth she wants to view so, for
> instance, they can read the Heading 1 information to get a "big picture"
> overview of the information and, using the outliner button bar, or a 
> number
> of different useful keystrokes, they can drill down further.  This creates

> a
> hierarchical view of your story board which can be corrected to jump from
> topic to topic under different headings by using the Word hyperlink 
> feature
> (I know this works with JAWS but haven't tried it with Window-Eyes or 
> System
> Access).
>
> Another approach would be to use PowerPoint slides in a logical, albeit
> hierarchical manner.  It has been a long time since I did anything
> interesting with PowerPoint but, if I remember correctly, you can include
> hyperlinks that will let the reader jump from one slide to another in a 
> less
> sequential order.  I find it easiest to create PowerPoint slides using the
> MS Word outliner - items at level 1 will translate to PP slide titles and
> those at level 2 or higher become PP bullets.  Once you have your outline
> done in Word, you can go to File/Send To/PowerPoint and it will create 
> your
> PP slides for you and open PP to the top slide.  From there, you can edit
> the slides to add things like hyperlinks and such to spiff up your
> presentation.  I know that editing PP slides can be done pretty well with
> JAWS as I've done it myself but I have been told that it works pretty 
> nicely
> with Window-Eyes but have no hands on experience with it so can't speak to
> its usability.
>
> I'm sure there are other tools that a blink can use to accomplish such a
> task but I haven't tried any and cannot remember what other people have 
> told
> me over the years as my caffeine levels haven't reached the point where I
> can function at full capacity.
>
> If your instructor doesn't like any of the above accessible solutions, I
> recommend you get hold of a Braille embosser or Perkins Brailler and make 
> a
> whole lot of pages in Braille.  Do not add any printed information and 
> turn
> in the project using only Braille and tactile graphics ( has a nice 
> program
> for doing this).  If the instructor complains, tell him that it was the 
> only
> accessible solution he hadn't rejected yet and that you will deal with the
> Office of the Dean of Students to try to help you negotiate a solution 
> that
> will work for you and the instructor.
>
> If your instructor does not allow you to use a technique that is 
> accessible
> typically colleges have an office of disability affairs and, if not, they
> definitely have a Dean of Students.  People in these departments are 
> usually
> quite helpful and aware of ADA and, if your college gets Federal money 
> (most
> do), 508 as well.  No one wants a discrimination lawsuit and, if it comes 
> to
> a point where you and your instructor reach a point at which negotiation 
> no
> longer provides either of you with any satisfaction, your lawyer's office 
> is
> the next stop.
>
> You can write to me privately or call me on Skype if you want to discuss
> this further.
>
> Enjoy,
> cdh
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of marvin hunkin
> Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2007 12:00 AM
> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: Story Boards
>
>
> Hi.
> doing a project for my website development course.
> now, part of the requirements says that i need to create a story board to
> represent what content is to be displayed on each page.
> Now sighted students, would draw navigation and story board diagrams.
> now, had to do this in word tables and tried html.
> but my lecturer is still not happy with what i have come up with.
> now, just wondering, is there any software, that might be able to 
> represent
> the story boards for the four websites that i am developing for this
> semester.
> any tips, tricks, or any other similar experiences.
> let me know, if anyone been in the same position.
> unfortunately the guy who did start to develop an accessible text to 
> speech
> drawing software, got his phd, and did not complete the project and still 
> in
> limbo.
> he got to the third user tests, and then nicked off.
> he did this at Burkely University in Callifornia and the product was to be
> called Intercommunication Draw 2.
> okay, can you help out or give suggestions or how to resolve these 
> problems?
> cheers Marvin.
>
>
> ________________________________
>
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