I understand entirely what you are saying, but please don't say you "broke the interpreter" even if you mean that metaphorically. You are implying that something is wrong with Python when there is not. Python is an interpreted language, and as such, it is usually implicitly slower than compiled languages. This should have been considered before the coding process even took place.
Don't take this as a personal attack, but it is common sense not to push an interpreted language too far. I am not going to write a 3D software rasterizer in Python because obviously Python (any interpreted language for that matter) most likely cannot handle that much data needing to be processed in real-time. It doesn't mean Python is broke, or that I broke Python. It means that Python is not the right tool for the Job, and I should not use it.
On 6/18/2011 3:09 PM, Ken Perry wrote:
We broke the interpreter well not broke per say but slowed it down enough to be the same thing. believe it or not python interpreters are not made to be operating systems or they would actually support multi threaded applications without having to get funky with the guile system. i will admit 2.6 and above has got better but python is a great language until you push it too far. I said what I said because I meant it. yes semantically your right python was still running it just wasn't running very good. Ken -----Original Message----- From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Christopher Coale Sent: Saturday, June 18, 2011 6:05 PM To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: Re: Java versus Python Please don't say you "broke" Python, as you did not. What you mean to say is that your development team broke your project. I'm unsure if you are referring to the execution speed of Python or the development time it took you to create applications; if you are referring to the former, then I must say that you (and/or your development team) did poor project planning. Did you not know that Python tends to be an interpreted language? That's something to consider when you are developing a performance-critical application. As for the indentation issue -- why was this not considered before the project started? Many people have no problems with the indentations, though, admittedly, some do. This should have been one of the things to consider during the planning stage. On 6/18/2011 2:42 PM, Ken Perry wrote:Sina I have told Tylor that I will not respond to anything he posts sothisis pushing it to answer your post here but yes I have went as far aspythoncan go and it broke. I don't like mentioning it because python is a great language for many things. but yes our rather large python project which is pretty much an accessible front end for Linux, word processor, webbrowser,media player, radio tuner, book reader, twitter application, rss reader, email, all wrote in python Just got to the point where python was slowing things down even know the major lifting was done with c++ modules. Sowhilewe could crank out more and more apps they got slower and slower. So yeswetook python where we thought it could go and it broke. I alreadymentionedonce where a block of code looked right but was not for example something like this if expression : do something do something do something do something Now that looks right if you intended the whole 4 lines to be in the if statement but if you were blocking the three lines and they took the indentation which some editors do you might not notice you had it at the same level as a blind coder. This happened actually to a sighted coderandthe code was in for a long time and I mean years before it was finally found. Luckily it was not that important a bit of code but it took ablindguy and some pain staking looking to find the problem. Granted this don't happen a lot but it does happen more than it does in languages that usetrueblocks of code. As for the typing of the language don't get me started you don't know how many times I and others have pushed stuff from the web into a sqlite3database and taken it out and got nothing like we expected because of unicode and Ascii. I still like python for quick stuff but give me a typedlanguageany day. Ken -----Original Message----- From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Sina Bahram Sent: Saturday, June 18, 2011 2:39 PM To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: RE: Java versus Python I have, as has Ken more than me, and both of us have experienced the complete misery that is the lack of proper typing in multiperson development teams. Out of curiosity, have you? been in a multiple person development team, I mean, so that you can back up how well Python works? Take care, Sina -----Original Message----- From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Littlefield, Tyler Sent: Saturday, June 18, 2011 9:48 AM To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: Re: Java versus Python Have you coded in python frequently enough to be able to back up the statement that coding in Python dies after big projects? I've added to some python projects and you can still code just as fast. On 6/18/2011 6:45 AM, John J. Boyer wrote:One reason we chose Java for BrailleBlaster is SWT. It really works as a cross-platform GUI builder. Once you get into a complex project the advantages of being able to develop something quickly in Python are much less. John On Sat, Jun 18, 2011 at 03:22:52PM +0300, black ares wrote:In fact it isn't a matter of preference. Best trained profesionals in this area choose the platform andtechnologybest tailored to the project needs. So If I have a project that I can do better and quick in python than Iwillchoose that langgage. If options are better in java I will choose it. Depends very much on the project requirements. ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Tseng"<davidct1209@xxxxxxxxx> To:<programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Saturday, June 18, 2011 5:15 AM Subject: Re: Java versus PythonI personally find arguments about programming languages much analogous to those seen in politics. Both sides have great points but tend to drive one another towards opposite extremes. Some camps are die hard dynamic language practitioners while others stick to strongly typed code. I will say that strongly typed languages have kind of won the battle historically. Most of the industry writes in C-styled languages like C/C++, java, etc. Lisp, still beloved by many, kind of lost. Python, as many have shown, works wonderfully and frees up coders to actually code, is still largely a wrapper on C. For those who want absolute performance, it's considered still an extra level of indirection that's not worth the productivity gain. I love python and its free-form style and the amount of progress you can make using it. Python excels at the rinse and repeat (compile, run, fix) style of coding. The few seconds you need to compile a C-styled language and run, you're already fixing the bug in python. You're not babied into writing object-oriented code ala java, but can independently mix in functional aspects if you wish. You can just as easily go OO if you want as well. On 6/17/11, Alex Hall<mehgcap@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:Programming is certainly a matter of preference in most situations. I would probably give up if the only option were php, since I really hate that language (no offense to anyone). Java is easy enough, but I agree that it feels bulky at times. I like Python's ease of use and readability, plus you can create executables with it, something that is difficult in java. Some people don't like that python is loosely typed, but I prefer saying: name=raw_input("Enter your name: ") to, if memory serves: name=new String(); in=new InputReader(); name=in.readLine(); or something along those lines. On 6/17/11, Littlefield, Tyler<tyler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:I've used both. I really like python because it comes on most *nix systems. I also like Python because of it's flexability andversatility.Java is nice enough, but it feels big bulky and clunky to me. Thatandthey seem to have some serious naming convention issues. Sometimes things are capitalized, sometimes they're not--.net makes more sense. On 6/17/2011 6:49 PM, John J. Boyer wrote:There has been a lot of discussion on the list lately about Python.Whyis that?Personally i much prefer Java. Its syntx makes a lot moresenseand it is just as powerful, if not more. A command-line build system like ant can take most of the hassle out of working with Javaclasses.personally, I prefer this to Eclipse. BrailleBlaster is written in Java. I am using openjdk-1.6, EclipseSWTand Apache Ant. John-- Take care, Ty my website: http://tds-solutions.net my blog: http://tds-solutions.net/blog skype: st8amnd127 My programs don't have bugs; they're randomly added features! __________ View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind-- Have a great day, Alex (msg sent from GMail website) mehgcap@xxxxxxxxx; http://www.facebook.com/mehgcap __________ View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind__________ View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind__________ View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind__________ View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind __________ View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
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