Re: Emacspeak on Mac OSX Revisited
- From: David Tseng <davidct1209@xxxxxxxxx>
- To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2011 07:18:00 -0700
There's still no reason why it shouldn't work assuming
- python bindings to tts, appkit are the same.
- various bugs in tts still the same (worked around in the server).
- aifc (used for tone generation) behaves the same.
Basically, just need to know where the server's crashing on his setup.
On 6/13/11, Ken Perry <whistler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> Ah maybe that's it. You I think are the first to be testing on something
> that old.
>
> Ken
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Kerneels Roos
> Sent: Monday, June 13, 2011 7:55 AM
> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: Re: Emacspeak on Mac OSX Revisited
>
> Ken, specs as follows:
> PPC Mac Mini,
> 1.41 GHz CPU clock,
> 512 MB RAM,
> OSX 10.5.8 (Leopard),
> Python 2.5,
> Last Xcode released for Leopard PPC (Xcode 3.4.1),
> latest everything else of the open source stuff (emacs, emacspeak and
> all dependencies installed by macports).
>
> Have noticed a Python 2.7 installation in /opt somewhere -- probably
> done by macports -- but I couldn't get the mac speech server to run off
> it since it struggled to find Python modules. Not sure how to resolve
> that. It might be as simple as including some path in some env var --
> any ideas?
>
> It's not a fast machine as you can see from the specs, but it should be
> able to run console stuff effortlessly.
>
> Some questions if I may:
>
> 001. Would running itt on Python 2.7 as apposed to the 2.5 version make
> a significant difference?
>
> 010. Is it possible that, although I did use macports to get latest
> emacs that it's still running some other, older emacs?
>
> 011. Is Command Key + F5, which toggles VoiceOver on and off, sufficient
> for getting VoiceOver out of the way?
>
> 100. Yes, binary numbering.... Just checking you are awake.
>
> Florian, thanks for the Alt / Option / Meta key tip.
>
> Kerns
>
> On 6/13/2011 12:32 PM, Ken Perry wrote:
>> Um it's not the terminal. What python are you using? What OS and such?
> I
>> can tell you that on this Mac book pro laptop the emacspeak runs like a
>> rocket.
>>
>> Ken
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Kerneels Roos
>> Sent: Monday, June 13, 2011 3:54 AM
>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Subject: Re: Emacspeak on Mac OSX Revisited
>>
>> Hi Ken,
>>
>> It would open up emacs but without the usual default text, as if
>> something was blocking or failing. When I ran emacs it worked like emacs
>> should. And of course, no speech :-). As an aside, this is exactly the
>> situation I experienced before under linux when I then just gave up on
>> it, but read on for a more pleasant ending...
>>
>> Well, Bart and Florian's posts put me in the right direction; I looked
>> at emacspeak/servers/mac, corrected the shabang at the top to point to
>> the proper Python:
>> #! /usr/bin/pythong
>> instead of
>> #! /usr/bin/python2.6
>>
>> Then I saw that the python script wasn't executable, did:
>> sudo chmod +x ./mac
>> and now, with VoiceOver turned off the testing of the speech server
> worked.
>>
>> Emacspaek still didn't seem to work totally right, so what I did is to
>> make config, make emacspeak and finally make install after changing the
>> ownership of the code to my user instead of root. Although I *thought* I
>> did your instructions verbatim, it seems that a bit of creativity on my
>> part caused me to type:
>> sudo svn co [url of emacspeak repo] etc.
>> so what was happening was that svn got emacspeak as root, I compiled it
>> as root, installed it as root and then tried to run it as non-root :-)
>>
>> After redoing everything (config, make) as my own user and only
>> installing as root, plus the DTK_PROGRAM=mac env var, plus the shabang
>> change, and with VoiceOver off... I slowly typed "emacspeak", held my
>> breath and slammed the enter button. Nothing, and then bang it started
>> talking; "My circuits are functioning perfectly -- where in the world
>> have you had a system saying that ha ha, quite retro!
>>
>> So it finally worked, but with a snag or two;
>> 1. the Alt, or Option key in Mac parlance doesn't seem to get picked up
>> so I had to use the alternative Escape key + whatever.
>>
>> 2. Also, the system seems very sluggish and normal cursor movements
>> would speak something, but then stop speaking (while the cursor is
>> actually moving around and then perhaps start speaking again. While
>> there is no speech you would just hear "beep" on every key press /
>> cursor movement as if it is thinking or you've reached the bottom of the
>> file (which is not the case, just the same kind of beep sound).
>>
>> I thing the problems described above is partly to be blamed on the
>> Terminal program, so next I'm going to try Bart's way of running a Cocoa
>> version of emacs with emacspeak.
>>
>> On my quest to get emacspeak working I delved into the docs in the svn
>> repo and man, without any intended insult to anyone, it is a big mess! A
>> few guys have written a lot of fine documentation, but it's very
>> fragmented and I couldn't find simple instructions on how the whole
>> speech server thing works. Also, there is docs there from way, way back
>> which most likely don't apply any longer. Docs labeled as containing
>> instructions on how to get espeak working with emacspeak doesn't have
>> that info in them and so on.
>>
>> Docs on actually using emacspeak and all it's modes / add ons I haven't
>> looked at since I just wanted install and config instructions, so can't
>> say anything about that. I can totally understand why people would just
>> give up on trying to setup emacspeak since things are very confused ---
>> sorry if you wrote emacspeak docs and this offends you! It's not my
>> intention to offend but to constructively critisize.
>>
>> Bart, that howto on how to get the mac version of the speech server to
>> work is a good project, but since the email you sent was apparently cut
>> off, where can I get the full version of that (if it exists already)?
>>
>> I guess this is the situation with most systems that are many years old
>> (docs being fragmented). Emacspeak is still a very exciting prospect,
>> but it would help if we can have a comprehensive path of docs how to get
>> it running first and then Alex's tutorial and others can take over from
>> there.
>>
>> Since emacs comes in windows versions as well, would it not be trivial
>> to get emacspeak also working on windows? Perhaps a new speech server
>> written with Stefic's phonemic?
>>
>> Regards,
>> Kerneels
>>
>>
>> On 6/10/2011 6:39 PM, Ken Perry wrote:
>>> When you say it doesn't work what happens when you type emacspeak.
>>>
>>> ken
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Kerneels Roos
>>> Sent: Friday, June 10, 2011 4:08 AM
>>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> Subject: Emacspeak on Mac OSX Revisited
>>>
>>> Hi List,
>>>
>>> Good day to you all. I've meticulously followed Ken's instructions for
>>> installing emacspeak on Mac OSX but it's still not speaking.
>>> Everything downloaded, compiled and installed without errors although
>>> macports did download a lot of stuff which I suppose emacs and emacspeak
>>> depends on.
>>>
>>> Emacs and even emacspeak does open, but no speech. The DTK_PROGRAM
>>> environment variable is set -- if I do "echo $DTK_PROGRAM " in a
>>> terminal it prints "mac".
>>>
>>> I'm not looking for emacspeak or emacs help since that is well
>>> documented by Alex's doc and others, but I am looking for more info on
>>> how to get emacspeak working on a mac. Here are some basic questions of
>>> which I didn't catch the answer although I've went through the posts
>>> meticulously.
>>>
>>> 1. Do you have to turn VoiceOver off before you start emacspeak?
>>>
>>> 2. Can emacspaek work with the VoiceOver sub system and use the mac TTS
>>> or do you have to use espeak?
>>>
>>> 3. Without actually running emacspeak is there a way to test all the
>>> components separately?
>>>
>>> 4. Can emacspeak only work in the terminal version of emacs or could it
>>> also work in a Cocoa version -- read something about Aqua Emacs ---
>>> looks like a GUI version of emacs.
>>>
>>> 5. Has anyone managed to get emacspeak working on Leopard (OSX 10.5.8)?
>>>
>>> 6. Any other nifty programmers editors for Mac? My beloved VIM, both
>>> terminal and GUI versions don't seem to play nicely with VoiceOver, or
>>> shall I rather say VoiceOver doesn't seem to play nicely with them since
>>> they are nice fellows!
>>>
>>> 7. I've asked before about a terminal program improvement over the
>>> standard terminal app in Leopard, which also doesn't work properly with
>>> VoiceOver. Any other ideas besides yassr and mactelnet?
>>>
>>> 8. Are there no full screen , basic terminal / console mode for OSX like
>>> in linux Ctrl+Alt + F1 for which Braille or voice can work? When booting
>>> and holding down Shift you get to a single user mode that is similar to
>>> the linuc console, so this does exist although that one doesn't have
>> speech.
>>> 9. A clever way to access a mac is of course via ssh -- saw Florian was
>>> doing this -- but then again no emacspeak possible there.
>>>
>>> 10. I understand emacspeak provides a sort of networkable speech
>>> protocol similar to X Windows which in theory would enable you to write
>>> a speech server placed anywhere on your network. How well does this
>>> really work? Could you for example ssh into a mac, set the speech up on
>>> emacspeak to use a speech server on the computer you are ssh'ing from?
>>>
>>> Many questions!
>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks in advance for anyone attempting to answer some of these.
>>>
>>> Kerns
>>>
>
> --
> Kerneels Roos
> Cell: +27 (0)82 309 1998
> Skype: cornelis.roos
>
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