Hi Joseph, Thanks for pointing these out. Jim -----Original Message----- From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Joseph Lee Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2011 4:26 AM To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx; programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx? Subject: Re: Bjarne Stroustrup talks about c++ and upcoming features in thelanguage Hi, I see. The best books for looking at data structs would be (from OReilly and obtained from Bookshare): * Practical C++ Programming - which provides some code segments, which helped me learn basic theory behind class design. * Mastering Algorithms in C: Some concepts behind things like quicksort and other useful ones. Uses C code, but easily adaptable to CPP. * Data Structures and Algorithms in Java and Java Cookbook - useful as a reference for Java code and how to do data structs with it. Cheers, Joseph ----- Original Message ----- From: "Littlefield, Tyler" <tyler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Date sent: Wed, 09 Mar 2011 22:13:02 -0700 Subject: Re: Bjarne Stroustrup talks about c++ and upcoming features in thelanguage Joseph: that makes sense now; I hope my last message didn't come across as rude, i was just curious. I was kind of trying to figure out where you were, since Sina's idea was totally different from your own. I agree with you that learning more languages is always useful; it's good to learn different languages. When I say "learn" a language, I mean be able to quickly develop in it, understand the stdlib that it uses, etc, as well as employ the techniques. For example, Java programmers tend to use different techniques than c++ will. Learning more programming languages in a sense is kind of like learning another language, with less enlightenment; it changes how you think about, approach and solve programming solutions. Maybe some Java techniques may not work in c++, but you learn a bit with each language that you can apply across the board. On a side note; I would like to learn how to work with those data structures; I haven't hit the class, but I've been keeping an eye out for a good book that will help out. A lot of the info I've found so far uses a lot of pictures, which makes things a bit dificult. On 3/9/2011 10:06 PM, Joseph Lee wrote: Hi, The point was learning to implement data structs using two or more different languages (my apologies if it sounded different). I thought I heard you saying you wanted to learn hash tables. Basically, my instructor told me to shift six bits to the left (from 32) to create mapping for possible ASCII characters. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Littlefield, Tyler" <tyler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Date sent: Wed, 09 Mar 2011 21:40:38 -0700 Subject: Re: Bjarne Stroustrup talks about c++ and upcoming features in thelanguage I'm kind of confused what this has to do with anything, though it is late, my head hurts and I've got a lot to get through. What does your bit manipulation hash have to do with it? Why do I get referenced there? More to the point, what does your point say? Sina basically said programing languages are just a jumble of text, and it doesn't matter whether or not you know it, as long as you know trees and graphs and all the shiny data structures. You're saying that it's good to know two different languages (which again invalidates his point), and you had a bit in there about where c++ was used, which doesn't click with his c++ is 10 years to late and useless because we have high-level languages now. On 3/9/2011 5:08 PM, Joseph Lee wrote: Hi, I agree with Sina on this point. The thing is, languages are created to either solve a specific problem or to be used on specific devices or OS platform. C++ is still a language of choice for some developers, but there are others out there which simplifies development effort at the cost of not knowing the insides of what's happening at the machine level. Personally, I'd prefer learning the equivalent syntax of two or more languages and how they differ before diving into advanced concepts like trees and tables (and yes, Tyler, I learned how to write hash function with bit manipulation). But, as I can say from experience, it is better to understand what's going on rather than the word description of what you are doing - for instance, you don't want to mess around with graph creation unless if you know how edges are represented (I prefer lists since they are easy to use than matrices, but matrix makes more sense from graphics point of view). That's all - JMO. Cheers, Joseph ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sina Bahram" <sbahram@xxxxxxxxx To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Date sent: Wed, 9 Mar 2011 18:54:49 -0500 Subject: RE: Bjarne Stroustrup talks about c++ and upcoming features in the language Man, am I glad medicine sure doesn't work that way. But hey, *smile*, I'm sure doctors would love to not learn anything new, *grin*. This is my personal advice, so take it or leave it. Every single language specific thing you learn is worth nothing more than the fleeting bits used to represent the ascii characters explaining it to you. It is nothing more than syntactic garbage taking up space in your head.. this has been true for the past 60 to 70 years, and it will be true for the next 70 years. That's why you should concentrate on learning concepts. Who cares if you can write a binary tree in C++, if you can't also write it, after only glancing at a reference manual for 10 minutes, in 25 other languages. languages come and go, but concepts hardly change. So, you can either focus and obsess on the 2011 specific stuff, or the stuff that has been true ever since Charles Babbage made his difference engine over a century ago. And for you ladies out there, yes I'm aware that Ada Lovelace actually did all the hard work, *grin*. Take care, Sina Take care, Sina -----Original Message----- From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Alex Midence Sent: Wednesday, March 09, 2011 6:48 PM To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: Re: Bjarne Stroustrup talks about c++ and upcoming features in the language Well, I'm glad the language has held still over the years. I'm stil a novice in this language and I'm glad I don't have to be so worried about my book or tutorial containing obselete code as I would be for Java. You can still take a c++ book written in 2004 or 2005 or something like that and use it to learn with. Unless I'm mistaken, you can't do this with c# or Java. I tried looking at Java a few months back and kept finding all these books that seemed to have a bunch of things you had to change with subsequent versions of Java. So, I for one am glad too much change hasn't come too quickly to it. Alex M On 3/9/11, Sina Bahram <sbahram@xxxxxxxxx> wrote: Fine, seriously belated, delayed, and not as useful as it would have been 10 years ago. Take car,e Sina -----Original Message----- From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Littlefield, Tyler Sent: Wednesday, March 09, 2011 6:39 PM To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: Re: Bjarne Stroustrup talks about c++ and upcoming features in the language But it wasn't. This is a long time in coming, but it doesn't make it useless. On 3/9/2011 3:41 PM, Sina Bahram wrote: Wow, how many decades has it been? Oh well, better later than never, or something, I'm sure. Sorry, this is kind of useless. This should have been done in 1999. Take care, Sina -----Original Message----- From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Alex Midence Sent: Wednesday, March 09, 2011 5:17 PM To: programmingblind Subject: Bjarne Stroustrup talks about c++ and upcoming features in the language http://csclub.uwaterloo.ca/media/C++0x%20-%20An%20Overview.html Fascinating video from the man himself. Interesting to hear his voice. For those who don't know, Bjarne Stroustrup is the man who invented c++. The language was originally called c with classes but then, he changed the name to c++ because in c, the ++ means incremental addition. Enjoy, Alex M __________ View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind __________ View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind -- Thanks, Ty __________ View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind __________ View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind __________ View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind __________ View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind __________ View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind -- Thanks, Ty __________ View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind __________ View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind -- Thanks, Ty __________ View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind __________ View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind This e-mail and any attachments to it are confidential and are intended solely for use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender immediately and then delete it. If you are not the intended recipient, you must not keep, use, disclose, copy or distribute this e-mail without the author's prior permission. The views expressed in this e-mail message do not necessarily represent the views of Highmark Inc., its subsidiaries, or affiliates. __________ View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind