Re: About lisp
- From: "Bob J." <rjustice004@xxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2008 15:57:56 -0800
Inthane,
MUMPS (as I know it) is an interpreted language that runs on what might
still be referred to as a "main frame" system. I know of no compiler to
generate a stand-alone executable file from MUMPS code that could be run in
the Microsoft Windows environment.
If anybody knows of one, I would be interested in hearing about it.
Bob
----- Original Message -----
From: "inthaneelf" <inthaneelf@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2008 11:46 AM
Subject: Re: About lisp
bob,
since your familiar with it, would it be useful still to new programmers and
do you think it is a "stand the test of time" language?
if you feel it is, would you be willing to do a fruit basket demo in it so I
can put it up on the fbd site for reference?
if you wish to, there is a downloadable file with the criteria for the demo
project on the site at:
http://fruitbasketdemo.alacorncomputer.com
thanks,
inthane
. For Blind Programming assistance, Information, Useful Programs, and Links
to Jamal Mazrui's Text tutorial packages and Applications, visit me at:
http://grabbag.alacorncomputer.com
. to be able to view a simple programming project in several programming
languages, visit the Fruit basket demo site at:
http://fruitbasketdemo.alacorncomputer.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob J." <rjustice004@xxxxxxxxxx>
To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2008 10:47 AM
Subject: Re: About lisp
> Last I heard, MUMPS is still alive and well although they now prefer to
> call
> it "M Technology." I retired as a MUMPS programmer about 17 months ago
> from
> the U. S. Department of Veterans Affairs. The curious may find info about
> this ANSI language at
> www.hardhats.org
>
> Bob
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Adrian Beech" <a.beech@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2008 5:03 AM
> Subject: RE: About lisp
>
>
> Yikes, Snobol... never thought I'd see that one mentioned again! To add
> to
> the trip down memory lane how about PL/1, ADA, Mumps, Simula64, BCPL,
> Prolog
> and and for good measure Modula-2.
>
> Sigh, the glory days of C... when real programmers didn't eat quiche :)
>
> Cheers.
> AB
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of tribble
> Sent: Thursday, 28 February 2008 8:26 AM
> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: Re: About lisp
>
> Yes, I think you are right -- there are a lot of general purpose languages
> out there lately. That is curious. It used to be languages were
> application specific -- fortran (formula translation) for engineers,
> snobol
> for string and list processing, a few functional languages for highly
> specialized recursive apps, apl for obfuscated math (sorry, apl read right
> to left and was painfully terse and tool a while getting used to), cobol
> for
>
> people who wanted to program database apps in english *smile*, web
> programming or markup languages for the net when it emerged, and dozens
> more -- when I was working they had application oriented languages (which
> they called AOL's) for use on the phone system software, I think with the
> explosion of AOL's there was a desire to write a general purpose language
> that could do everything. Then smalltalk and eiffel and c++ et al came
> along and then java and c#, and extensions to vb and perl/php to do
> OO-like
> designs, and python and ruby and whatever else...
> My fingers are getting tired *smile*
> So there is many to one and one to many and this keeps hoards of
> programmers
>
> employed as they try to grab the coolest features for their
> projects...*smile*
> I think it's interesting that python is indentation sensitive. Sounds
> like
> a pain for blind programmers that don't look at indentation, but I also
> think it is a plus for those same programmers as it makes for code that
> can
> be shared with sighted programmers.
> Anyway, happy hacking!
> --le
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Chris Hofstader" <chris.hofstader@xxxxxxxxxxx>
> To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2008 7:10 AM
> Subject: RE: About lisp
>
>
> Hi,
>
> I always thought of that other editor as: type vi at the command prompt
> and
> very little will change.
>
> The one thing that I'm a bit curious about these days is why the sudden
> explosion of new languages? For the longest time, a platform had its
> primary language, UNIX, GNU/Linux and DOS used C, Macintosh had some
> dialect
> of Pascal and AppleEvents, mainframes had Fortran and COBOL, VMS had PL/I.
> There were also a lot of narrowly focused languages like Lisp for AI work,
> DB2 for databases, JCL for making your mainframe happy, etc.
>
> In the last few years, though, I see an increasingly large number of
> general
> purpose languages arriving on the scene (Ruby, Python, Lua, C#, J#, Java
> and
> a bunch more) and I can't entirely understand why so many people are
> investing so much time and money in programming languages.
>
> cdh
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of tribble
> Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2008 6:38 AM
> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: Re: About lisp
>
> Hey Chris -- I never heard that historical vignette about emacs -- thanks
> for the flashback! I remember that time period but at the time I was using
> "that other editor", vi, but emacs definitely was a major presence. It's
> funny but it is easy to lapse into nostalgia over cool projects that we
> were
>
> working on back then, especially if the software got popular and used by a
> lot of people, but in the corporate world with management shooting down
> projects like ducks, they used to tell people not to get emotionally
> attached to projects, which a lot of people did, both guys and gals, so
> the
> dynamics were crazy -- but my response to the recommendation not to get
> attached to a project was that after picking bits for 60 hours a week for
> months or years on a piece of software, and seeing it trashed, it really
> wasn't possible to dissociate from a project totally -- you needed to like
> the project in order to put that much effort into it, but projects came
> and
> went so fast you soon learned to be mercenary.
> I think the 80s and 90s were pivotal in computer science though, so small
> bit-picking projects such as DOS for example (not that I ever worked on
> DOS)
>
> exploded into phenomena like Microsoft and windows that took over the
> world,
>
> and the stuff we all did on C++ back in the 80s and 90s also was pivotal,
> and when it started getting popular everyone was trying to jump onto it.
> I
> suppose times are similar now, but not so much as in the 80s and 90s --
> for
> all those currently working in the industry, is that true? My impression
> is
>
> that projects are smaller and more numerous and come and go more quickly.
> Happy hacking all!
> --le
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Chris Hofstader" <chris.hofstader@xxxxxxxxxxx>
> To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2008 6:03 AM
> Subject: RE: About lisp
>
>
> Of course, you are correct I wasn't referring to a GUI for programming in
> Lisp as, back in those days, emacs was the Lisp programming environment
> for
> Lisp hacking and virtually all of those guys agreed upon it as the best
> solution. Goz wrote the first emacs in some strange system that was
> difficult and even more difficult to modify. Stallman and the others
> agreed
> that Lisp was the perfect language for making editors and other tools like
> them and thus was born the emacs we all know and love. When Goz went off
> to
> commercialize all of the cool system tools made around the AI lab in those
> days, he took the Lisp version and called it UniPress emacs. Stallman and
> the others founding Project GNU gave distributed the Lisp based one as GNU
> emacs.
>
> Getting all nostalgic again: back in those years UniPress ran a monthly
> full
> page advert in UNIX World with a whole bunch of heads in shadow on a grey
> background with quotes on why they preferred Gosmacs. At FSF, we took a
> bit
> of our fundraising budget and got photos of a big chunk of the computer
> science pantheon (including Minsky, McCarthy, Guy Steele, Hal Abelson,
> Gerry
> Sussman, Rodney Brooks, Patrick Winston, Knuth, Bob Boyer and others whom
> I
> cannot think of with my caffeine mg to hour ratio so dangerously low) and,
> arranged exactly like their ad but with the text, "GNU Emacs Users Aren't
> Afraid to Show Our Faces," and, under each giant of the field a quote
> praising both emacs and another extolling project GNU or the concept of
> free
> software.
>
> We believe we won the day when Unipress had a totally different ad the
> following month saying something about how one can never know what they
> may
> get if they use a program that includes the source. We fired back with a
> one luminary per month advertisement series saying exactly why the GNU
> versions were more stable, more secure and, of course, you don't have to
> wait for some programmers in New Jersey to fix bugs because you already
> have
> the source and can do it yourself. In those years, the proportion of
> people
> who read UNIX World who were also programmers of some sort was pretty
> huge.
>
> Sina, I know you aren't fond of emacs but, keep in mind, this debate was
> going on about a decade before you were born and anything that even
> approached a integrated development environment was radically cool. Over
> that decade, we added so much like full integration with lots of
> languages,
> gdb and so many other cool things that people take entirely for granted
> these days. It was a real exciting time to be around the lab, around GNU
> and, if one had an interest in programming tools, I doubt any other point
> in
> space time (except maybe at Parc Place when Adele was in charge) could
> even
> give the slightest indication of what it felt like. Knowing you as well
> as
> I do, I think you would have felt as though you had stumbled into Xanadu
> if,
> at 21 years old, you were like many of the other guys your age who made
> that
> stuff happen in the lab back then.
>
> I'll go start the history/mid-life crisis list later today.
>
> Enjoy,
> cdh
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Sina Bahram
> Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 11:24 PM
> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: RE: About lisp
>
> It's interesting that you mentioned a novel windowing system and not a
> graphics interface for programmers. *smile*, two quite separate things.
> One
> deals in abstract terms involving stacks, queues, overlays, priority
> scheduling, possibly coordinate management, and so on. The other deals
> with
> setting the background color to red, defining buttons inside of classes
> for
> windows, and generally very dirty looking code. The former can be quite
> beautiful, and still is, in lisp, the latter is hardly beautiful in any
> language, especially in lisp.
>
> Take care,
> Sina
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Chris
> Hofstader
> Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 10:55 PM
> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: RE: About lisp
>
> The first known windowing system was written by Richard Greenblatt in Lisp
> at MIT when he was still a student. He would later go onto Director of AI
> and then form LMI (Lisp Machines Incorporated) which would be at the
> center
> of the controversy that would pit Greenblatt/Stallman and the free
> software
> people (Hal, Jerry, Rod, etc.) against those who would form Symbolics and
> the other proprietary source companies that just took the work from the AI
> Lab and commercialized it.
>
> No one really remembers Symbolics or Goz and that crowd nor does anyone
> remember LMI. Greenblatt's Sleazy Windowing System, however, has a solid
> place in history. Unfortunately, Greenblatt and his crew had to invent a
> new computer designed specifically to run Lisp and the windowing system as
> nothing on the market had either the horsepower or the kinds of processor
> instructions needed to run Lisp with any efficiency back then.
>
> cdh
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Ken Perry
> Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 8:55 PM
> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: RE: About lisp
>
>
>
> I want to agree with Sina here if your going to write Lisp write lisp
> don't
> try to shove GUI into it cause that just spells guilisp and unless you
> have
> the flew you don't need that.
>
> Ken
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Sina Bahram
> Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 5:37 PM
> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: RE: About lisp
>
> Ken did a great job with that one, and he realized a great deal of the
> headache that goes into lisp and GUI programming, but I will say that it
> is
> a horrible example of lisp. This has nothing at all to do with Ken's code,
> which is great. It's just that the lisp fruit basket is not representative
> of the really powerful phrasings of most problems that can exist in lisp,
> and instead it ends up being multi-line calls of special parameters to
> functions to design a win32 dialog.
>
> Take care,
> Sina
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of inthaneelf
> Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 8:23 PM
> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: Re: About lisp
>
> I believe I have some info on lisp in the definitions file for the fruit
> basket demo version in that language, either that or I got some info from
> one of the computer dictionaries on a search from it, both of which have
> links on the fruit basket home page.
>
> HTH,
> Inthane
> . For Blind Programming assistance, Information, Useful Programs, and
> Links
> to Jamal Mazrui's Text tutorial packages and Applications, visit me at:
> http://grabbag.alacorncomputer.com
> . to be able to view a simple programming project in several programming
> languages, visit the Fruit basket demo site at:
> http://fruitbasketdemo.alacorncomputer.com
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "tribble" <lauraeaves@xxxxxxxxx>
> To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 6:20 AM
> Subject: Re: About lisp
>
>
>> Re: apl
>> I wonder if it was just one of those academic languages there only for
>> the purpose of teaching a comparative language class... Which leads
>> me to the
>> following: Did anyone ever program in a language called icon? It was
>> popular when I got my masters, but I haven't heard of it lately...
>> --le
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Chris Hofstader" <chris.hofstader@xxxxxxxxxxx>
>> To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> Sent: Monday, February 25, 2008 6:05 AM
>> Subject: RE: About lisp
>>
>>
>> I never even met someone who programmed in APL. My brother made his
>> living in SmallTalk and all of its graphicality for a while but now
>> he's working for Microsoft and, I'd assume, he works using their
>> languages.
>>
>> cdh
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Sina
>> Bahram
>> Sent: Sunday, February 24, 2008 8:41 PM
>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Subject: RE: About lisp
>>
>> APL is such an amazingly cool sounding language ... I really tried to
>> get into it a while back, but it's not easy to program in a graphical
>> programming language, *grin*
>>
>> Take care,
>> Sina
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of tribble
>> Sent: Sunday, February 24, 2008 3:15 PM
>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Subject: Re: About lisp
>>
>> ah yes, snobol -- loved that language -- memories -- the runtime
>> environment we used to run snobol was called spitbol (kind of weird)
>> -- did you ever write anything in apl? That was a fun one also that
>> stretched the mind a bit. I don't know about current use of lisp.
>> --le
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Macarty, Jay {PBSG}" <Jay.Macarty@xxxxxxxx>
>> To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> Sent: Friday, February 22, 2008 6:01 PM
>> Subject: About lisp
>>
>>
>> Sina,
>> Way back in the day, I took a course on languages which covered about
>> 8 different ones in a single course. Probably the most obscure of
>> these was snobol for which a class mate and I wrote an interpreter. I
>> recall studying lisp but was wondering what it is generally used for
>> these days and if a free command line compiler is available?
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Sina
>> Bahram
>> Sent: Friday, February 22, 2008 9:03 AM
>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Subject: RE: what is Hex?
>>
>> You're absolutely correct my friend. Needless to say I feel extremely
>> bad about this. Sorry!
>>
>> I sat down and wrote out -127 in twos complement and realized I can
>> also represent -128.
>>
>> Obviously this applies to 32 bit representations and so on, as well.
>>
>> Sorry again ... It appears that programming in lisp and java have
>> dulled my senses.
>>
>> Take care,
>> Sina
>>
>> ________________________________
>>
>> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Nirandas
>> Sent: Friday, February 22, 2008 12:02 AM
>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Subject: Re: what is Hex?
>>
>>
>> Hi Sina,
>> As I understand, a byte can contain 256 unique values. So a signed
>> byte's maximum and minimum range should be -128 to 127 not
>> -127 to 127.
>>
>>
>> Nirandas
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Sina Bahram <mailto:sbahram@xxxxxxxxx>
>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Sent: Friday, February 22, 2008 9:50 AM
>> Subject: RE: what is Hex?
>>
>>
>> Again, I'm sorry for the disagreement, but there are several flaws in
>> this explanation. I've attempted to correct them below.
>>
>> The standard byte's signed values are -127 to 127, not -128 to 127 ...
>> it's being picky, but this is extremely important and the source of
>> 90% of most security flaws today.
>>
>> A standard word is a misnomer. This assumes a two byte word which is
>> only true on 16-bit architecture. A word can be 16 bits, 32-bits, or
>> even
>> 11 bits
>> in some platforms ... it just depends. A double word can be 32 bits,
>> but it can also be 16 bits in some platforms or not even supported in
>> others, so there is no standard here.
>>
>> However, using twos complement, I must again clarrify the minimum and
>> maximum of a 16 bit value, since it is not -32768 to 32767, I'm
>> afraid, but is instead -32767 to 32767
>>
>> As for a 32 bit value, the minimum and maximum are as follows.
>>
>> Using twos complement, the signed minimum and maximum of a 32-bit
>> integer are -2147483647 to 2147483647 , and the minimum and maximum of
>> an unsigned
>> 32 bit integer are 0 to 4294967295
>>
>> Hope this clears things up.
>>
>> Take care,
>> Sina
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Ian D.
>> Nichols
>> Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2008 5:40 PM
>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Subject: Re: what is Hex?
>>
>> Hi Listers,
>>
>> As I see it, things have become a little muddled here, both in James's
>> message and in Sina's reply.
>>
>> The standard byte is still 8 bits, containing unsigned values of 0 to
>> 255 and signed values of -128 to +127.
>>
>> The word contains 16 bits, with unsigned values of 0 to 65535, and
>> signed values of -32768 to +32767.
>>
>> The double word contains 32 bits, with very large values possible.
>> Unsigned, 0 to 4 thousand millions, and signed values from -2
>> thousand millions to + 2 thousand millions, more or less.
>>
>> I hope I've got my thinking straight on that, and haven't caused
>> further confusion.
>>
>> All the best,
>>
>> Ian
>>
>> Ian D. Nichols,
>> Toronto, Canada
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Sina Bahram" <sbahram@xxxxxxxxx>
>> To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2008 4:58 PM
>> Subject: RE: what is Hex?
>>
>>
>> A few things. big endian versus little endian is arbritrary, so it's
>> not a fact with respect to storage.
>>
>> More importantly, the minimum and maximum of a signed 32 bit integer
>> is not
>> -65535 to 65535, it's actually -32767 to 32767
>>
>> If it is signed, then it is 0 to 65535
>>
>> At the end of the day, you only have 2^16 permutations of 16 bits in a
>> binary system; thus, you have a maximum of 65536 positions, and so you
>> have half as much capacity if you are using twos complement to allow
>> for both negative numbers and the concept of 0.
>>
>> Hope this helps
>>
>> Take care,
>> Sina
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of James
>> Panes
>> Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2008 2:35 PM
>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Subject: Re: what is Hex?
>>
>> Yes, Hexidecimal numbers are 0, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, A, B, C, D,
>> E, F for a total of 16 possible digit values.
>>
>> As stated before, this is much more convenient for the computer as
>> 16 is an
>> even power of 2 and computers actually use binary, 0 and 1. The
>> hexidecimal representation is actually easier for humans to read than
>> binary.
>> Hexidecimal digits are grouped into groups of 2 for a total of 16 x
>> 16 or
>> 256 possible values. This is a standard byte. Before unicode, a single
>> byte value was used to represent an alphanumeric character and two
>> bytes or a word were used to represent a 32 bit integer with values
>> possible from
>> -65535 to 65535. This explains the limit of the size of variables in
>> older games.
>>
>> The original Intel 8086 processor had 16 bit registers. Operations for
>> anything larger had to be synthisized with software.
>>
>> What's more, for integer values larger than 255, the least significant
>> pair of digits is stored first. For example, if you were looking for
>> the value
>> 301 (decimal) in a game save file, you would find it represented as
>> 23 01 in
>> the save file.
>>
>> Since this list is about programming and not game save file hacking, I
>> will end my lecture here.
>>
>> Anyone with further interest in this topic can write me off-list
>>
>> Regards,
>> Jim
>> jimpanes@xxxxxxxxx
>> jimpanes@xxxxxxxxxxxx
>> "Everything is easy when you know how."
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Valiant (on laptop)" <valiant@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> Sent: Tuesday, February 19, 2008 8:43 AM
>> Subject: Re: what is Hex?
>>
>>
>> Hi.
>> I didn't see anyone mention this part about hex.
>> Hex is just another number scale like the standard one 0 to 9 or the
>> binary one 0 to 1. Hex is 0 to f I think, making it bass 16, where the
>> one we use every day 0 to 9 is bass 10 and binary is bass, hmm,
>> someone help? 0 to 1?
>> The possible digits in hex are 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, a, b, c, d,
>> e, f can't remember if hex starts with 0. It lets you have larger
>> numbers without taking up as much space. MAC addresses on networking
>> equipment use it.
>> some of that could be wrong, it's been two whole years since I had to
>> study that, here.
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Sina Bahram" <sbahram@xxxxxxxxx>
>> To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> Sent: Monday, February 18, 2008 4:03 PM
>> Subject: RE: what is Hex?
>>
>>
>> 21, but yes he is, Thanks Chris
>>
>> Take care,
>> Sina
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Marlon
>> Brandão de Sousa
>> Sent: Friday, February 15, 2008 12:12 PM
>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Subject: Re: what is Hex?
>>
>> Are you serious about Sina being 22 years old only? Man I have seen
>> people who have studied computers for many more than this quantity of
>> years and don't seen to know a half of what Sina knows easily ...
>> Marlon
>>
>> 2008/2/15, Chris Hofstader <chris.hofstader@xxxxxxxxxxx>:
>>> God Sina, you bring back memories of Z80 and needing to "poke"
>>> instructions and data into memory before execution. I would have
>>> thought you, who was born in 1986 would never had to get to that
>>> level. Personally, I think it's a really valuable exercise even
>> if
>>> one never actually needs to use it in a "real" program just to get
>> a
>> better understanding of what a processor "sees"
>>> and how base 16 numbers can be turned into both instructions and
>> data
>>> depending upon how the processor looks at them.
>>>
>>> In the network edition of "Bank Street Writer" a word processing
>>> program written entirely in assembly, that was pretty popular in
>> the
>>> years before you learned to talk, I added a function called,
>>> "DON'T_CALL_THIS." If you did call it the program would crash as
>> the
>>> instructions looked random. If, however, you looked at the last
>>> handful of bytes of the program as ASCII, it read "FSMITHISAWORM."
>>> Frank Smith, a really great guy, was the client on the gig and we
>>> decided to immortalize him in an Easter Egg that only an ubergeek
>> could
>> find.
>>>
>>> Now, just for shits and giggles, try to reconstruct the function
>> in
>>> 80x86 assembly and receive the truly wasted chunk of time award.
>>>
>>> cdh
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Sina
>>> Bahram
>>> Sent: Thursday, February 14, 2008 9:28 PM
>>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> Subject: RE: what is Hex?
>>>
>>> *smile*, wlel actually, if you really want to get down to it ...
>> it can
>> be.
>>>
>>> Assembler compiles down to executable instructions to the
>> processor,
>>> which are most often and most easily read in hex.
>>>
>>> I used to know almost all of the 8086 instructions and some of
>> their
>>> hex equivalents a while back. It's really useful when analysing
>>> exploit and virus code.
>>>
>>> Take care,
>>> Sina
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Alex
>> Hall
>>> Sent: Thursday, February 14, 2008 8:47 PM
>>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> Subject: re: what is Hex?
>>>
>>> Right, but it almost sounds like some sort of programming
>> language.
>>>
>>> Have a great day,
>>> Alex
>>>
>>> > ----- Original Message -----
>>> >From: Joseph Lee <joseph.lee22590@xxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> >To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> >Date sent: Thu, 14 Feb 2008 17:27:12 -0800
>>> >Subject: re: what is Hex?
>>>
>>> >Hi Alex,
>>> >It's a shortened form of hexadecimal.
>>> >Cheers,
>>> >Joseph
>>>
>>> >> ----- Original Message -----
>>> >>From: Alex Hall <mehgcap@xxxxxxx
>>> >>To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> >>Date sent: Thu, 14 Feb 2008 20:18:21 -0500
>>> >>Subject: what is Hex?
>>>
>>> >>Hi all
>>> >>Whatis this Hex that has been talked about
>>> >recently?
>>>
>>> >>Have a great day,
>>> >>Alex
>>> >>__________
>>> >>View the list's information and change your
>>> >settings at
>>> >>//www.freelists.org/list/programmingblin
>>> >d
>>>
>>> >__________
>>> >View the list's information and change your settings at
>>> >//www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
>>>
>>>
>>> __________
>>> View the list's information and change your settings at
>>> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
>>>
>>> __________
>>> View the list's information and change your settings at
>>> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> __________ NOD32 2878 (20080215) Information __________
>>>
>>> This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system.
>>> http://www.eset.com
>>>
>>>
>>> __________
>>> View the list's information and change your settings at
>>> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> When you say "I wrote a program that crashed Windows," people just
>> stare at you blankly and say "Hey, I got those with the system, for
>> free."
>> Linus Torvalds
>> __________
>> View the list's information and change your settings at
>> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
>>
>> __________
>> View the list's information and change your settings at
>> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
>>
>>
>> __________
>> View the list's information and change your settings at
>> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
>>
>> __________
>> View the list's information and change your settings at
>> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
>>
>> __________
>> View the list's information and change your settings at
>> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
>>
>>
>>
>> __________
>> View the list's information and change your settings at
>> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
>>
>> __________
>> View the list's information and change your settings at
>> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
>>
>>
>>
>> __________
>> View the list's information and change your settings at
>> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
>> __________
>> View the list's information and change your settings at
>> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
>>
>> __________
>> View the list's information and change your settings at
>> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
>>
>> __________
>> View the list's information and change your settings at
>> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
>>
>>
>>
>> __________ NOD32 2899 (20080225) Information __________
>>
>> This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system.
>> http://www.eset.com
>>
>>
>> __________
>> View the list's information and change your settings at
>> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
>>
>> __________
>> View the list's information and change your settings at
>> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
>>
>
>
> __________
> View the list's information and change your settings at
> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
>
> __________
> View the list's information and change your settings at
> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
>
> __________
> View the list's information and change your settings at
> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
>
>
>
> __________ NOD32 2903 (20080226) Information __________
>
> This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system.
> http://www.eset.com
>
>
> __________
> View the list's information and change your settings at
> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
>
> __________
> View the list's information and change your settings at
> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
>
>
>
> __________ NOD32 2905 (20080227) Information __________
>
> This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system.
> http://www.eset.com
>
>
> __________
> View the list's information and change your settings at
> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
>
> __________
> View the list's information and change your settings at
> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
>
>
>
> __________ NOD32 2905 (20080227) Information __________
>
> This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system.
> http://www.eset.com
>
>
> __________
> View the list's information and change your settings at
> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
>
> __________
> View the list's information and change your settings at
> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
>
>
> __________ NOD32 2908 (20080228) Information __________
>
> This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system.
> http://www.eset.com
>
>
> __________
> View the list's information and change your settings at
> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
>
> __________
> View the list's information and change your settings at
> //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
>
__________
View the list's information and change your settings at
//www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
__________
View the list's information and change your settings at
//www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
Other related posts:
