[PigeonRing-PML] PIGEONS-LIST Digest - 16 Mar 2008 to 17 Mar 2008 (#2008-77)

  • From: Cliff <pigeonring@xxxxxxxxx>
  • To: pml-pigeonring@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, PML Freelist <pigeonring-pml@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2008 12:31:55 -0400


There are 20 messages totalling 1753 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

 1. PIGEONS-LIST Digest - 11 Mar 2008 to 12 Mar 2008 (#2008-72)
 2. Maintaining high returns
 3. Self Loading System
 4. National Geographic (8)
 5. Spring is in the air: (2)
 6. FW: Whites in with Ferals
 7. Whites in with Ferals
 8. Bird droppings and suppliments winsmore...
 9. Fw: <No subject given>
10. RACE:  Are you still flying?  PART 1
11. RACE:  Are you still flying.  PART 2
12. white racing birds my two cents worth


Subject:
Re: PIGEONS-LIST Digest - 11 Mar 2008 to 12 Mar 2008 (#2008-72)
From:
John Lucchese <PS259@xxxxxxx>
Date:
Mon, 17 Mar 2008 06:52:37 EDT

Harry,
"Charm School" Which one? Do they have correspondence courses? LOL, LOL. I like your style Harry, Charm Schools have a lot of pretty young girls in the student body,
hmmmmmm, LOL. Regards,

John Lucchese



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Subject:
Re: Maintaining high returns
From:
Jackie Greenough <jmgreeno@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date:
Mon, 17 Mar 2008 09:12:27 -0400

Thank you for the time and caring in writing this, Jerry.  One big question
and something I have never done.....you wrote:

"Breed tight into the qualities. Pick and mate the pairs based on
performance and necessary factors only.
Do not breed from pairs that picked their own mate."

All my pairs have mated on their own.  I have had good birds from them.  Are
you expecting something to go amiss because of this kind of mating?

Thank you.



-----Original Message-----
From: Pigeon_Mailing_List [mailto:PIGEONS-LIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
Behalf Of gerald perrone
Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2008 10:40 AM
To: PIGEONS-LIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Maintaining high returns

Hi:
I have had a number of folks E-mail me about losses. A
few were racing folks and the rest were Release
Handlers.

Here are a few of the things that we discussed that
will sharply increase returns. Regardless of racing or
releasing.

Have a loft that is designed properly and never
overcrowd. Do your homework.

Start out and choose carefully stock that demonstrates
qualities consistent with your circumstances and
requirements.  Size, short or long distances, color
and eye requirements, etc., etc., etc.. Research,
research and visit, visit, visit.

Breed tight into the qualities. Pick and mate the
pairs based on performance and necessary factors only.
Do not breed from pairs that picked their own mate.

Maintain a loft management system that promotes health
and vigor. Without proper management you will never be
successful in gathering a mature colony.

Practice loft management techniques that promote
"early on the wing" and train stock vigorously every
day. Flying stock, must have all the requirements
necessary to perform. Mature muscle, full supply of
sugar, fat and hydrated to a three day minimum on
board at all times.

Train stock to the basket till they are settled in the
basket. All stock should be as relaxed in the basket
as they are on their home perch. Never overcrowd.
Permit ample space for each bird to turn and sit
without having to come face to face with another bird.

Never send young stock down the road till they are
fully matured and fully muscled. If the breast and
feather do not indicate full and mature; do not box.
The breast muscle must be fully developed and indicate
no further repair and building can be done. Then and
only then do you start your stock down the road.

Never rush distances. Train for a 360 degree and
radiate out. Repeat often release points that are
going to be on common routes.

Never force stock out of a basket. Stock should jump
for the dropped flap. If a bird hesitates or lingers,
close flap and return to loft. Check out for possible
problems and correct as necessary. Always give
adequate time for recovery and watch carefully. Send
down the road only when bird is back in form.

Always gather your stock at night or self load. Never
chase stock in the loft for boxing. Small injuries are
caused by chasing stock and then the injury is further
inflamed with the workout. Chances are that the bird
will return this time but will fall by the wayside the
following time released.

Protect your stock from foolish releases and they will
repay you many times over. This is a very tricky part
of loft management. If the weather is bad and the
release is way out then its a no brainer. However, it
gets a lot more complicated when the weather is poor
and the release is not to far down the road. Now it is
up to you to know what your stock is capable of.
Your judgment has to do with a worsening condition or
a clearing condition. You have to make these calls on
the confidence you have in your stock. If you are
confident and have done your job then you will soon
realize the results.

Protect a mature flying colony and only utilize
individuals that you are sure can perform, deliver and
return within a normal stress limit. Watch how your
stock returns and how they act upon return.
Try not to overfly your stock. About 600 miles a week
per bird will allow for quick recovery of fat and
sugar. If you are flying past the 600 miles per bird,
then you need more stock. Repeated stressing will
lower form of the bird in the loft or the bird will go
down and may not get home.

Maintain a mature colony. Keep your stock motivated by
breeding only when "absolutely necessary" and keeping
them on dummies the rest of the time. Without constant
YB's in the loft the colony settles into a more
sanitary and stable regiment. The stock snaps back
from stress much faster.

Remember these are only a few of the things a loft
manager and handler must practice daily.

Following the above mentioned regiment will aid you in
gathering a mature colony that will perform year after
year.

Keep them flying:
Jerry
Highland Loft
Harbor Springs, MI.

PS: This is not a promotion for the sale of pigeons.




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Subject:
Re: Self Loading System
From:
Jackie Greenough <jmgreeno@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date:
Mon, 17 Mar 2008 09:14:04 -0400

Hi Gerard.  Do you have a link or photos of your system?  Thank you.




-----Original Message-----
From: Pigeon_Mailing_List [mailto:PIGEONS-LIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
Behalf Of Gerard Regnier
Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2008 1:58 AM
To: PIGEONS-LIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Self Loading System

Our birds have been using "Self Loading" for years. We wouldn't think of
doing it any other way. Each of the baskets are lined up along the
outside of the loft. There is a trap door between the loft and each
basket. After a basket is filled, the trap door closes and then the
basket doors are closed. We can load eight baskets in parallel. Each
basket holds about 15 birds.

Initially, the first time we introduce the young birds to this system,
it seems like the birds will never get used to going into the carriers
by themselves. After about the fourth time they begin to learn and
understand what you are trying the get them to do. After that, the going
gets easier each time the birds get basketed.

By using this system, we have been able to basket a 150 bird race team
in less than four minutes flat. That is from the time we put the baskets
down until the last bird goes into the basket. This is definitely, by
far, the best way to basket the birds. By using this method the birds
get very tame because they know that you are not going to chase them
around and catch them. By self loading we never damage a single feather
or accidentally injure a bird by trying to catch it. by using this
method, at about the end of the racing season each bird becomes so tame
that they don't even try to get away if we want to handle a bird inside
the loft.

We too like to handle each bird to determine it's condition, molt status
and health before we send it down the road.

Gerard Regnier
RFLoft
Fremont, CA

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Subject:
Re: National Geographic
From:
chip piller <chip.piller@xxxxxxxxx>
Date:
Mon, 17 Mar 2008 09:54:27 -0400

I very much enjoyed the National Geographic "Pigeon Genius" show, they
did a very nice job and stressed that pigeons were champion flyers,
champion navigators, and champion breeders.   I found a couple of
points interesting:

1) The program showed that pigeons use their air sacs and lungs
together and that their lungs are super efficient one way structures
with fresh air/oxygen flowing in one end and stale air/CO2 exiting
from the other end.

2) Genetic plasticity, over time using selection man has created many
exotic fancy breeds.  The show suggested that one could take two
pigeons from two different fancy breeds, cross them, and then in a
couple of generations the offspring would revert once again to the
wild type rock dove.

Overall a good program that portrayed pigeons in a positive light.

--Chip



Subject:
Re: National Geographic
From:
john sampson <Sampsonbrothers@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Date:
Mon, 17 Mar 2008 09:58:16 -0400

I have that Channel and couldn't see it listed, I have Digital Cable and
High Def too, strange, I'll keep looking  ????????

John S.
WWW.Sampsonbrothers.com (check us out)
Sampsonbrothers@xxxxxxxxxxxx

-----Original Message-----
From: Pigeon_Mailing_List [mailto:PIGEONS-LIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
Behalf Of chip piller
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2008 9:54 AM
To: PIGEONS-LIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: National Geographic

I very much enjoyed the National Geographic "Pigeon Genius" show, they
did a very nice job and stressed that pigeons were champion flyers,
champion navigators, and champion breeders.   I found a couple of
points interesting:

1) The program showed that pigeons use their air sacs and lungs
together and that their lungs are super efficient one way structures
with fresh air/oxygen flowing in one end and stale air/CO2 exiting
from the other end.

2) Genetic plasticity, over time using selection man has created many
exotic fancy breeds.  The show suggested that one could take two
pigeons from two different fancy breeds, cross them, and then in a
couple of generations the offspring would revert once again to the
wild type rock dove.

Overall a good program that portrayed pigeons in a positive light.

--Chip



Subject:
Spring is in the air:
From:
gerald perrone <doverelease@xxxxxxxxx>
Date:
Mon, 17 Mar 2008 07:51:54 -0700

Hi All:
Still have several feet of snow on the ground and
nights are dropping into the low teens, but I know
spring is not far off. We are with light from about
6:30AM till almost 7:30PM. With each day giving us an
additional minute of light. The days are bright and
the sun is so hot that we ski with only a sweat shirt
on.
Within a few weeks we will be skiing in the morning
and golfing in the afternoon.
There has been an open loft since winter set in, but
last night, just after dark I headed in for their
feeding, ( I was late due to a wine tasting that went
longer then expected), and inside the loft was a
mature great horned owl.
She had the stock a little nervous, but not real bad.
I have seen many varieties of owls from California to
the Hindu Coush, but this bird was absolutely
beautiful close up. It would hang upside down off the
ceiling slates and expand its wings. The wing span was
around five feet. Well, after admiring her for a bit,
I tossed her back out and she disappeared into the
darkness with out the slightest sound.
Up north living, you just got to love it.
This ethereal episode also puts the loft back on a
lock down regiment with call out and call in.
Next week I will start to shut down all breeding and
get ready for cleanup and dummies.
Our first onslaught of major events begin in early
May.
Ah, spring is in the air.

Keep them flying:
Jerry
Highland Loft
Harbor Springs, MI.






____________________________________________________________________________________
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know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ



Subject:
Spring is in the air:
From:
gerald perrone <doverelease@xxxxxxxxx>
Date:
Mon, 17 Mar 2008 07:55:08 -0700

Hi All:
Still have several feet of snow on the ground and
nights are dropping into the low teens, but I know
spring is not far off. We are with light from about
6:30AM till almost 7:30PM. With each day giving us an
additional minute of light. The days are bright and
the sun is so hot that we ski with only a sweat shirt
on.
Within a few weeks we will be skiing in the morning
and golfing in the afternoon.
There has been an open loft since winter set in, but
last night, just after dark I headed in for their
feeding, ( I was late due to a wine tasting that went
longer then expected), and inside the loft was a
mature great horned owl.
She had the stock a little nervous, but not real bad.
I have seen many varieties of owls from California to
the Hindu Coush, but this bird was absolutely
beautiful close up. It would hang upside down off the
ceiling slates and expand its wings. The wing span was
around five feet. Well, after admiring her for a bit,
I tossed her back out and she disappeared into the
darkness with out the slightest sound.
Up north living, you just got to love it.
This ethereal episode also puts the loft back on a
lock down regiment with call out and call in.
Next week I will start to shut down all breeding and
get ready for cleanup and dummies.
Our first onslaught of major events begin in early
May.
Ah, spring is in the air.

Keep them flying:
Jerry
Highland Loft
Harbor Springs, MI.






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Subject:
Re: National Geographic
From:
John Sampson <sampsonbrothers@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Date:
Mon, 17 Mar 2008 12:12:22 -0400

All the listings are crazy, I have it on both NG channe;ls today at 1:00 pm (in an hour) I looked at 11:00 nadda. However I did catch Miranda Lambert, country singer, WOW, she has it all, sings good too.

I'll watch it at 1:00 I hope.

Thanks,

John S.
Sampsonbrothers@xxxxxxxxxxx
www.Sampsonbrothersloft.com (check us out)
----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Sordahl" <turbit1@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <Sampsonbrothers@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2008 11:36 AM
Subject: RE: National Geographic


> John I have it listed for 11:00am today eastern time. Michael
>
> RacingPigeonUSA  - Quality Birds for Great Prices at
> www.RacingPigeonUSA.com
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Pigeon_Mailing_List [mailto:PIGEONS-LIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
> Behalf Of john sampson
> Sent: Monday, March 17, 2008 8:58 AM
> To: PIGEONS-LIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: Re: National Geographic
>
>
> I have that Channel and couldn't see it listed, I have Digital Cable and
> High Def too, strange, I'll keep looking  ????????
>
> John S.
> WWW.Sampsonbrothers.com (check us out) Sampsonbrothers@xxxxxxxxxxxx
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Pigeon_Mailing_List [mailto:PIGEONS-LIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
> Behalf Of chip piller
> Sent: Monday, March 17, 2008 9:54 AM
> To: PIGEONS-LIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: Re: National Geographic
>
> I very much enjoyed the National Geographic "Pigeon Genius" show, they
> did a very nice job and stressed that pigeons were champion flyers,
> champion navigators, and champion breeders.   I found a couple of
> points interesting:
>
> 1) The program showed that pigeons use their air sacs and lungs together
> and that their lungs are super efficient one way structures with fresh
> air/oxygen flowing in one end and stale air/CO2 exiting from the other
> end.
>
> 2) Genetic plasticity, over time using selection man has created many
> exotic fancy breeds.  The show suggested that one could take two pigeons
> from two different fancy breeds, cross them, and then in a couple of
> generations the offspring would revert once again to the wild type rock
> dove.
>
> Overall a good program that portrayed pigeons in a positive light.
>
> --Chip
>
>


Subject:
Re: National Geographic
From:
john sampson <Sampsonbrothers@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Date:
Mon, 17 Mar 2008 12:21:57 -0400

DVR, Tivo, etc. it's all way over my head, I like to keep it simple, which
aint possible anymore, as it is I need 2 remotes for 1 TV now.

John S.
WWW.Sampsonbrothers.com (check us out)
Sampsonbrothers@xxxxxxxxxxxx

-----Original Message-----
From: Jackie Greenough [mailto:jmgreeno@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2008 11:38 AM
To: 'John Sampson'
Subject: RE: National Geographic

Yes, you have regular NG and high def (821)  I recorded it.  You need to get
a dvr  :-)



-----Original Message-----
From: John Sampson [mailto:sampsonbrothers@xxxxxxxxxxx]
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2008 11:08 AM
To: Jackie Greenough
Subject: Re: National Geographic

I just found out we have 2 NG channels, I'll check the other one, someone
posted a note with several more air times, I'll get it for you if you want ?

Thanks,

John S.
Sampsonbrothers@xxxxxxxxxxx
www.Sampsonbrothersloft.com (check us out)
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jackie Greenough" <jmgreeno@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <Sampsonbrothers@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2008 10:59 AM
Subject: RE: National Geographic


> > Looks like it aired again this morning at 10 am. I think that's the last > > one. I also looked up your NGHD channel and it is 821, but I guess we're
> > a
> > day late and a dollar short, eh.  I can try and transfer to a disc for
> > you.
> > Or maybe it will come on again.
> >
http://google.nationalgeographic.com/search?site=default_collection&client=d
> >
efault_frontend&proxystylesheet=default_frontend&output=xml_no_dtd&oe=UTF-8&
> > q=pigeon+genius&btnG=Go
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: john sampson [mailto:Sampsonbrothers@xxxxxxxxxxx]
> > Sent: Monday, March 17, 2008 10:34 AM
> > To: 'Jackie Greenough'
> > Subject: RE: National Geographic
> >
> > Nope I have Comcast.
> >
> > John S.
> > WWW.Sampsonbrothers.com (check us out)
> > Sampsonbrothers@xxxxxxxxxxxx
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Jackie Greenough [mailto:jmgreeno@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]
> > Sent: Monday, March 17, 2008 10:23 AM
> > To: Sampsonbrothers@xxxxxxxxxxx
> > Subject: RE: National Geographic
> >
> > If you have Time Warner, it should be the same for you as for us. We are > > Tampa Bay BrightHouse, but they are associated with Time Warner. The HD
> > channel here is 727
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Pigeon_Mailing_List [mailto:PIGEONS-LIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
> > Behalf Of john sampson
> > Sent: Monday, March 17, 2008 9:58 AM
> > To: PIGEONS-LIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > Subject: Re: National Geographic
> >
> > I have that Channel and couldn't see it listed, I have Digital Cable and
> > High Def too, strange, I'll keep looking  ????????
> >
> > John S.
> > WWW.Sampsonbrothers.com (check us out)
> > Sampsonbrothers@xxxxxxxxxxxx
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Pigeon_Mailing_List [mailto:PIGEONS-LIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
> > Behalf Of chip piller
> > Sent: Monday, March 17, 2008 9:54 AM
> > To: PIGEONS-LIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > Subject: Re: National Geographic
> >
> > I very much enjoyed the National Geographic "Pigeon Genius" show, they
> > did a very nice job and stressed that pigeons were champion flyers,
> > champion navigators, and champion breeders.   I found a couple of
> > points interesting:
> >
> > 1) The program showed that pigeons use their air sacs and lungs
> > together and that their lungs are super efficient one way structures
> > with fresh air/oxygen flowing in one end and stale air/CO2 exiting
> > from the other end.
> >
> > 2) Genetic plasticity, over time using selection man has created many
> > exotic fancy breeds.  The show suggested that one could take two
> > pigeons from two different fancy breeds, cross them, and then in a
> > couple of generations the offspring would revert once again to the
> > wild type rock dove.
> >
> > Overall a good program that portrayed pigeons in a positive light.
> >
> > --Chip
> >
> > No virus found in this incoming message.
> > Checked by AVG.
> > Version: 7.5.519 / Virus Database: 269.21.7/1332 - Release Date: 3/17/2008
> > 10:48 AM
> >
> >
> > No virus found in this outgoing message.
> > Checked by AVG.
> > Version: 7.5.519 / Virus Database: 269.21.7/1332 - Release Date: 3/17/2008
> > 10:48 AM
> >
> >
> > No virus found in this incoming message.
> > Checked by AVG.
> > Version: 7.5.519 / Virus Database: 269.21.7/1332 - Release Date: 3/17/2008
> > 10:48 AM
> >
> >
> > No virus found in this outgoing message.
> > Checked by AVG.
> > Version: 7.5.519 / Virus Database: 269.21.7/1332 - Release Date: 3/17/2008
> > 10:48 AM
> >
> >

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG.
Version: 7.5.519 / Virus Database: 269.21.7/1332 - Release Date: 3/17/2008
10:48 AM


No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG.
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10:48 AM




Subject:
FW: Whites in with Ferals
From:
lonettemckee <flatdaddy@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date:
Mon, 17 Mar 2008 12:24:57 -0400

-----Original Message-----
From: lonettemckee [mailto:flatdaddy@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]
Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2008 6:39 PM
To: 'PIGEONS-LIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx'
Subject: Whites in with Ferals

At least Twenty five-years ago (when there were still a lot of ferals around
NY before they started the mass slaughter for the hunt clubs) I was seeing
big, strong healthy looking pure white pigeons in with ferals in Brooklyn
NY. Not knowing what I know now I didn't note if they were banded.
The documentary on the propaganda by extermination companies to make people
fear and hate them was also very interesting. IN MY OPINION.
Lonette


Subject:
Re: Whites in with Ferals
From:
Ken Strong <strong@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date:
Mon, 17 Mar 2008 11:57:10 -0600

In my opinion there is no documentary on the propaganda by extermination companies to make people fear and hate pigeons. As pigeons interbreed they have a tendency to breed smaller pigeons. That is why most feral pigeons are smaller. Also I did not know that there was a mass slaughter for the hunting clubs. Ken


----- Original Message ----- From: "lonettemckee" <flatdaddy@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <PIGEONS-LIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2008 10:24 AM
Subject: FW: Whites in with Ferals


> -----Original Message-----
> From: lonettemckee [mailto:flatdaddy@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]
> Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2008 6:39 PM
> To: 'PIGEONS-LIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx'
> Subject: Whites in with Ferals
>
> At least Twenty five-years ago (when there were still a lot of ferals around > NY before they started the mass slaughter for the hunt clubs) I was seeing
> big, strong healthy looking pure white pigeons in with ferals in Brooklyn
> NY. Not knowing what I know now I didn't note if they were banded.
> The documentary on the propaganda by extermination companies to make people
> fear and hate them was also very interesting. IN MY OPINION.
> Lonette
>


Subject:
Bird droppings and suppliments winsmore...
From:
Bruce & Michelle McCallister <bmmccallister@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Date:
Mon, 17 Mar 2008 15:05:48 -0400

Never knew that a simple vitamin suppliment would have such a huge impact on my birds. Today is day 5 with the Winsmore product. The droppings are perfect. Little or no moisture to be seen. Chestnut color with a little topping of white. Sounds like a sundae ha ha...Their behavior is different when eating, before they seemed more ravenous for certain grains now they seem to take their time eating and are more relaxed at it. Since I live in Michigan I believe they were deficent in A and D vitamins. Had one baby with a crooked keel. We had a winter with very little sunshine to speak of. There could of been other dificencies but at least now I know they are taken care of. Also learned to make sure the grit is of high quality an has a high calcium content. And to change it often in case they are taken what they need and it just sits there with what they dont need. If that makes sense...As long as everything stays like this I see no need to give them anything else. If it ant broken dont try to fix it.. Winsmore is an awesome suppliment for my situation and breed of pigeons. I highly reccommend it.. Bruce..

Subject:
Re: National Geographic
From:
Richard Boucher <Pipukwes@xxxxxxx>
Date:
Mon, 17 Mar 2008 15:19:22 EDT

I watched it again today at 1:00 pm est . I have Time Warner as a cable net so times may vary according to carriers...
richard

In a message dated 3/17/2008 11:19:23 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, sampsonbrothers@xxxxxxxxxxx writes:

All the listings are crazy, I have it on both NG channe;ls today at 1:00 pm (in an hour) I looked at 11:00 nadda. However I did catch Miranda Lambert,
   country singer, WOW, she has it all, sings good too.

   I'll watch it at 1:00 I hope.

   Thanks,

   John S.
   Sampsonbrothers@xxxxxxxxxxx
   www.Sampsonbrothersloft.com (check us out)
   ----- Original Message -----
   From: "Michael Sordahl" <turbit1@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
   To: <Sampsonbrothers@xxxxxxxxxxx>
   Sent: Monday, March 17, 2008 11:36 AM
   Subject: RE: National Geographic


   > John I have it listed for 11:00am today eastern time. Michael
   >
   > RacingPigeonUSA  - Quality Birds for Great Prices at
   > www.RacingPigeonUSA.com
   >
   >
   > -----Original Message-----
> From: Pigeon_Mailing_List [mailto:PIGEONS-LIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
   > Behalf Of john sampson
   > Sent: Monday, March 17, 2008 8:58 AM
   > To: PIGEONS-LIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
   > Subject: Re: National Geographic
   >
   >
> I have that Channel and couldn't see it listed, I have Digital Cable and
   > High Def too, strange, I'll keep looking  ????????
   >
   > John S.
   > WWW.Sampsonbrothers.com (check us out) Sampsonbrothers@xxxxxxxxxxxx
   >
   > -----Original Message-----
> From: Pigeon_Mailing_List [mailto:PIGEONS-LIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
   > Behalf Of chip piller
   > Sent: Monday, March 17, 2008 9:54 AM
   > To: PIGEONS-LIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
   > Subject: Re: National Geographic
   >
   > I very much enjoyed the National Geographic "Pigeon Genius" show, they
   > did a very nice job and stressed that pigeons were champion flyers,
   > champion navigators, and champion breeders.   I found a couple of
   > points interesting:
   >
> 1) The program showed that pigeons use their air sacs and lungs together
   > and that their lungs are super efficient one way structures with fresh
   > air/oxygen flowing in one end and stale air/CO2 exiting from the other
   > end.
   >
   > 2) Genetic plasticity, over time using selection man has created many
> exotic fancy breeds. The show suggested that one could take two pigeons
   > from two different fancy breeds, cross them, and then in a couple of
> generations the offspring would revert once again to the wild type rock
   > dove.
   >
   > Overall a good program that portrayed pigeons in a positive light.
   >
   > --Chip
   >
   >




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Subject:
Re: National Geographic
From:
John Sampson <sampsonbrothers@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Date:
Mon, 17 Mar 2008 15:24:55 -0400

Well I got to see it, great job, best documentry I've seen on pigeons that was done by a non-pigeon person at least. In my opinion, it was on the same scale as Jim Jenners work, super job..

John S.
Sampsonbrothers@xxxxxxxxxxx
www.Sampsonbrothersloft.com (check us out)
----- Original Message ----- From: "John Sampson" <sampsonbrothers@xxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <PIGEONS-LIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2008 12:12 PM
Subject: Re: National Geographic


> All the listings are crazy, I have it on both NG channe;ls today at 1:00 pm (in an hour) I looked at 11:00 nadda. However I did catch Miranda Lambert, country singer, WOW, she has it all, sings good too.
>
> I'll watch it at 1:00 I hope.
>
> Thanks,
>
> John S.
> Sampsonbrothers@xxxxxxxxxxx
> www.Sampsonbrothersloft.com (check us out)
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Sordahl" <turbit1@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> To: <Sampsonbrothers@xxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Monday, March 17, 2008 11:36 AM
> Subject: RE: National Geographic
>
>
>> John I have it listed for 11:00am today eastern time. Michael
>>
>> RacingPigeonUSA  - Quality Birds for Great Prices at
>> www.RacingPigeonUSA.com
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Pigeon_Mailing_List [mailto:PIGEONS-LIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
>> Behalf Of john sampson
>> Sent: Monday, March 17, 2008 8:58 AM
>> To: PIGEONS-LIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Subject: Re: National Geographic
>>
>>
>> I have that Channel and couldn't see it listed, I have Digital Cable and
>> High Def too, strange, I'll keep looking  ????????
>>
>> John S.
>> WWW.Sampsonbrothers.com (check us out) Sampsonbrothers@xxxxxxxxxxxx
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Pigeon_Mailing_List [mailto:PIGEONS-LIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
>> Behalf Of chip piller
>> Sent: Monday, March 17, 2008 9:54 AM
>> To: PIGEONS-LIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Subject: Re: National Geographic
>>
>> I very much enjoyed the National Geographic "Pigeon Genius" show, they
>> did a very nice job and stressed that pigeons were champion flyers,
>> champion navigators, and champion breeders.   I found a couple of
>> points interesting:
>>
>> 1) The program showed that pigeons use their air sacs and lungs together
>> and that their lungs are super efficient one way structures with fresh
>> air/oxygen flowing in one end and stale air/CO2 exiting from the other
>> end.
>>
>> 2) Genetic plasticity, over time using selection man has created many
>> exotic fancy breeds.  The show suggested that one could take two pigeons
>> from two different fancy breeds, cross them, and then in a couple of
>> generations the offspring would revert once again to the wild type rock
>> dove.
>>
>> Overall a good program that portrayed pigeons in a positive light.
>>
>> --Chip
>>
>>


Subject:
Re: National Geographic
From:
Richard Boucher <Pipukwes@xxxxxxx>
Date:
Mon, 17 Mar 2008 15:33:36 EDT

John S,
I agree it puts the birds in a better light and may help change some peoples perception of pigeons.and help our sport at the same time.

Richard B.
Maine

In a message dated 3/17/2008 2:29:32 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, sampsonbrothers@xxxxxxxxxxx writes:

Well I got to see it, great job, best documentry I've seen on pigeons that was done by a non-pigeon person at least. In my opinion, it was on the same
   scale as Jim Jenners work, super job..

   John S.




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Subject:
Re: National Geographic
From:
John Sampson <sampsonbrothers@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Date:
Mon, 17 Mar 2008 16:07:50 -0400

I've yet to see anything done by or for them that was not top shelf.

John S.
Sampsonbrothers@xxxxxxxxxxx
www.Sampsonbrothersloft.com (check us out)

   ----- Original Message -----
   From: Richard Boucher
   To: PIGEONS-LIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
   Sent: Monday, March 17, 2008 3:33 PM
   Subject: Re: National Geographic

    John S,
I agree it puts the birds in a better light and may help change some peoples perception of pigeons.and help our sport at the same time. Richard B.
   Maine
In a message dated 3/17/2008 2:29:32 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, sampsonbrothers@xxxxxxxxxxx writes:

Well I got to see it, great job, best documentry I've seen on pigeons that was done by a non-pigeon person at least. In my opinion, it was on the same
       scale as Jim Jenners work, super job..

       John S.




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Subject:
Fw: <No subject given>
From:
John & Jackie VDL <j.vdl@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Date:
Mon, 17 Mar 2008 18:02:16 -0400

Good buy Lonette,we'll miss you -----------like the we miss the plague.
          John VDL
----- Original Message -----
From: lonettemckee
Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2008 10:54 AM
Subject: <No subject given>

SIGN OFF Pigeon List


Subject:
RACE: Are you still flying? PART 1
From:
"Elwin F. Anderson" <elwinzperch@xxxxxxxxx>
Date:
Mon, 17 Mar 2008 23:41:22 GMT

A copy of this post got to John S but the list rejected it as too long. So since I took the time to write it for you all, I will resend it in two parts.
To members of the List:
A few days ago in a private exchange, John Sampson asked me "Are you still flying or did you retire?" That seems like a simple enough question. One that could be answered in a couple of words. I found it difficult to answer either way, so I am replying to John on the list so all of you will be updated. A few years ago I decide to retire so that I could travel without the pigeons to concern me over the winter. Then in the spring I would fly birds for others in the futurity and auction races. So I had a full team of yb which flew the entire series. After the series the breeders could take their young back. I had several young Birds of the Series which went back to their old loft as breeders. I recommend fanciers who go south for the winter and return in the spring, consider this. It is a pleasure for the fancier, and good for the club. Club members should encourage this for such members. Some members felt that they should discontinue having two 300 mile races in the yb series. I felt I would retire if that happened, since it wouldn't be worthwhile to buy young birds in the auction and go to the expense and effort of taking care of the birds and training without a full series to fly. The shorter schedule was adopted in mid-winter '04/'05. I had already purchased youngsters for the '05 Auction Race so I was obligated for 2005 and it would be my last season. When the old bird season was about to start I still had six of the '04 yb team that no one had taken. The club members kidded me. Why don't you ship them in the ob series since you still have them there. They were having the 50 mile truck training that week. My six went along. When I was leaving the traps open for the trainer to come home, four of the other birds returned and wouldn't leave so with permission I had a ten bird old bird team. I believe I developed a near perfect way to fly old birds, at least very simple with no extra effort. I was flying the ybs on the darkening system, sexes separated. Lights came on at 8 am, off at 4 pm (8 hours). Windows darkened all of the time. The ten yearlings stayed in the yb loft separated, also. As soon as the yb caught up, they went on the truck training with the old birds.
(To be continued)

Elwin F. Anderson
Everett, WA, USA



Subject:
RACE: Are you still flying. PART 2
From:
"Elwin F. Anderson" <elwinzperch@xxxxxxxxx>
Date:
Tue, 18 Mar 2008 00:28:34 GMT


Here I was flying ten yearlings which no one had taken, five to each race. They were flying against large teams, some more than 40 birds. They won 4 first places including first at the longest race, 451 miles from Weed, California. My team finished 3rd in the Club, near that in the concourse, for ob. Points are distributed based on loft order of placement. In yb my team also took four first places, including a double win at the 300, and another bird of the year. For the year, young and old, I missed being champion by ten seconds In the final race, if I had been ahead of one more loft or if Dr. Nelson had been beaten by one more loft my teams would have been the champion. I felt that God had given me the enthusiasm and energy to have another pretty good last year at 85 years of age. After breeders had gotten their birds back I stated in the free pets classified section of the Herald that I would give a pair of tested racing pigeons which had raced from Oregon and California to anyone who did not already have pigeons but had a building in which to keep them properly. Several went that way. Then I quit giving them away. WHY? People always ask me,"How are the pigeons". When I would say that I am getting rid of them, the reaction was the same. Shock, and you shouldn't do that. So now whether it is my minister, doctor, the mayor, or Lions club members, my answer is that I only have a few but they are fine. A year ago I had wintered just four birds and had sold my clock. But with a little egging-on by some club members, I borrowed a clock and shipped the four birds, 2 to each race. Didn't win any, but occasionally I would finish ahead of fanciers shipping as many as 40 birds. Heard some interesting explanations. I wintered two birds this year, so I guess I will have to ship just one to each race. How long will they last???? Two hens, and they have been on the darkening system since January. So I can still say that I have flown at least one series every year since 1933. Last week one of the members said to me, I have three youngsters, do you want them. I said "why not, I'll have to get them ready to fly. I don't want to keep any unflown birds. And if my too old birds fall by the wayside, hawk or wire, I will need another couple of birds. That way, I will still be able to answer the question "How are the pigeons?" with an honest "just fine". If you are still with me, You now know why I didn't answer John Sampson with a simple yes or no to the question, "Are you still flying or did you retire".

Elwin F. Anderson
Everett, WA, USA



Subject:
white racing birds my two cents worth
From:
charles cole <lostplanetavrpl@xxxxxxxxx>
Date:
Mon, 17 Mar 2008 19:42:30 -0700

Hi All,
I've been enjoying all of this discussion on the white birds.I have only had white homers for the past four years,I have bred pigeons for over fifty years,I didn't fly my first race till 1962,every shipping night was just like Christmas eve for a kid to me I couldn't sleep with the anticipation of the up coming race day.I'm having to sit out this old bird series,but I will be shipping young birds to three out of area races,some of my entries will be whites.And No I won't be entering any white bird special olympics!Ya have to be able to run with the big dogs, or just stay under the porch! LOL Getting back to the white birds,The first three years I was just bringing in the best of the best white stock I could get my hands on,from many sources, some worked out some didn't I have culled without mercy and used every bit of pigeon grading knowledge I have picked up over the last half century, and have come a long way in a short time.Am I there yet?Defiantly not. But I haven't lost a single bird in several months and had very light losses prior to that,these are birds that have been trained and worked hard,We did in excess of two hundred releases last year with this team,in all directions, at odd hours, many times with no time for mistakes in getting home, brides and funerals can run late. Unfortunately the sun is always right on schedule.I truly have seen the term late for his own funeral in real life over and over.I have a few of the whites on my racing team,and they were very close in performance to my best racing birds, they were usually my third and fourth birds in the clock every race they flew.I was only home to see them come in a couple of times last season,but they were still coming in that order.Our club recently received a big group of birds from the Flamingo International race as fund raiser auction birds, several of them were 99% white just the slightest hint of color,it is not cheap to enter this race, so they must be pretty good. And just like my whites I could, blind fold you and hand you these whites,just grabbed at random from the perches, along with the finest racing birds of color, and you would just think they were another fine racing bird,with all the stuff we look for.perfect bone structure, soft silky feathers, one pin tail feathers,tight vents,all the right reflexes, balance, supple muscles,and character.Will that make them all winners? not by a long shot! But at this rate in a few years after more selection, and trying.I will probably have quite a few top class white racing birds on my team.I think as we see more white birds in the races we will see more winning whites.Right now the majority of winners seem to be blue bars, then blues checks, dark checks , etc etc.It may be partially a matter of numbers,increasing the probability.Well this all falls under what I call (Pigeon Zen),if you think you know and understand pigeons, then you really don't have a clue .that's my 2 cents worth.
Wishing all of you the luck of the Irish, on this St. Patrick's day,
Charlie

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Other related posts:

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