-=PCTechTalk=- Re: Start Problem? G-Man...
- From: Gman <gman.pctt@xxxxxxxxx>
- To: <pctechtalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Mon, 9 Jun 2008 18:03:18 -0400
Cajun,
In troubleshooting all this, the idea here is to reasonably eliminate
each part that can be removed from the list of suspects. To that end, you
and Hubby seem to be doing a wonderful job. You are also doing a great job
summing up the steps you're taking and that makes it much easier for me to
even be involved in the process. So, let's see what's left to put under the
microscope.
The entire process of turning on your computer involves the switch, it's
wiring, the mainboard header pins and their associated mainboard wiring, the
special +5v line that carries the "On" and related signals, the power supply
that supplies that +5v line as well as the main switch in the back of the PS
which provides power to the entire PS, the power cord that connects the PS
to a source of main power, the surge protector and its internal circuitry,
the wall outlet you use and finally, the circuit breaker in your mains (the
box that controls power for the entire house). Anything beyond that is also
well beyond the scope of our troubleshooting.
Test:
You changed cases in order to eliminate the switch and its wiring.
Result:
Nothing changed. The assumption is that the switch was not the issue.
Test:
You tried firing up the system using a screwdriver instead of the switch.
Result:
It started up every time using the screwdriver, so the mainboard is not the
problem.
These two results tell us that something very odd is going on here. The
screwdriver trick is normally used to point the finger back at the switch,
its wiring or the plug at the end of its wiring, but all of those things
were already reasonably removed from the mix of suspects. So, either
'reasonably' eliminating the switch isn't enough because you happened to get
a case with another bad switch (possible, but improbable) or something else
is clogging up the works here.
You said that throwing the switch on the back of the power supply enabled it
to work for a while, but leaving the system alone for a while brought the
issue back. That alone makes me wonder about a possible bad PS switch.
Retry the tester on the big line and try applying some pressure to this main
switch on the back of the unit to see if it fluctuates at all. Since the
system was off during this 'left alone' time, it may be important to note
that both the system AND the power supply were allowed to cool down. You
replaced the power cord to the PS and again witnesses no change in the
behavior of the system. You also mentioned that you run the system through
a surge protector and have already answered my next set of questions about
the state of its lights. This is very important since the lights will
flicker or no longer work after it has absorbed all of the spikes it can
handle. At this point, it would be time to replace the surge protector to
regain that protection. Since yours glows steady, it is assumed that the
protector is doing what you need to do. You also stated that you are
bypassing the surge protector at times and testing the system on a different
outlet, presumably
(but not verified) on a different circuit breaker. That is very good to
hear since that would be one of my next choices.
All of this evidence leads me to question whether you have an overall lack
of power available at the mains. If you have a multimeter, I have a better
use than testing the switch (although you should also do that and report
back with the ohm reading you get). Switch the meter over to AC voltage and
test each of the wall outlets you're using. It wouldn't surprise me a bit
to hear that it's coming in at under the expected rating of ~110-115VAC. If
that's the case (and assuming your in a warm place), it may be due to
heavier loads on the power grid by air conditioners and refrigerators
working overtime. There may also be an issue where the outlets &/or breaker
you're using are not rated high enough for what you're trying to pull from
them. Also, the PS tester you have only tests for the presence of voltage,
but may not tell you exactly how off that voltage might be (the LEDs turn on
well before you reach the indicated voltage).
There's more rolling around in my head, but I have to go and get some food
shopping done right now. Hopefully, you'll have a reply for me by the time
I return and we can pick it up from there. :O)
Peace,
G
"The only dumb questions are the ones that are never asked"
----- Original Message -----
From: "cajun12" <cajun12@xxxxxxx>
To: <pctechtalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, June 09, 2008 3:05 PM
Subject: -=PCTechTalk=- Start Problem? G-Man...
> G-Man, we've been troubleshooting some things again, and here's what we =
> have. Last weekend hubby and I did the screwdriver on the power switch =
> pins test you suggested. We did it about 6 times and it started every =
> single time. So we plugged the power switch back in and pressed it a =
> few times, and the computer started first time every time. Then it =
> missed a time and started on the second time. We brought it back to my =
> desk and hooked everything up and started it a few times, and it started =
> the first time each time. We turned it off and left for a few hours and =
> when we got back, I had to press the button over and over for it to =
> start. I changed the power cord on it to one that had never been used =
> before, and we tried plugging it into a different plug on the surge =
> protector. I have a Belkin SurgeMaster Maximum Series with 9 outlets, =
> phone/fax/modem protection, and a green "protected" light and an amber =
> "ground" light, Model #F9M923-08, joules rating 2650. The green and =
> amber lights always glow steadily and never flicker. This protector is =
> 5 years old now. The new cord and a different plug made no difference. =
> It should be noted that when we're troubleshooting it, we take it up =
> front to the kitchen where it is plugged into a different electrical =
> circuit and we are not using the surge protector for short spurts of =
> testing.
>
> Changing the power cord and plugging it into a different spot on the =
> surge protector did no good. One thing that seems to make a difference =
> is toggling the on/off switch on the back of the power supply! We just =
> discovered this. For the past 2 days, it has started during the first 5 =
> start button presses after toggling the on/off switch a few times as =
> opposed to 20-40 presses otherwise. What could toggling this switch be =
> affecting? I've tested the power supply several times and moved the =
> wires around while doing it and the readings didn't even blip. This is =
> an Antec 430 Watt Truepower 2.0 purchased on October 15, 2006. It is =
> less than 2 years old. This power supply has the ability to monitor =
> case fan speeds when plugged directly into its "Fan Only" plugs, and you =
> can monitor the speed of the power supply's fan if you plug its 3-pin =
> connector into the motherboard. I have the back case fan plugged into =
> the motherboard, the side case fan plugged into the power supply, and I =
> do not have the psu's 3-pin connector plugged into the motherboard =
> because I'm planning to put another fan up front to plug into the =
> motherboard's front fan plug. The manual boasts dual 12V output =
> circuitry, over current protection, over power protection, under voltage =
> protection, and short circuit protection.
>
> I've been told that we can use an ohm meter to test the case switch and =
> that it should read 100. Can you verify this? I'm still having a hard =
> time believing it's the switch because it's done the exact same thing in =
> 2 cases, this case is brand new, but it does take a lot more start =
> button presses in this case than it did in the other and all components =
> are the same. It takes about the same amount of presses in this case as =
> the old case if we toggle the on/off psu switch. I don't know how long =
> this will be true. There were over 400 very good reviews on this =
> CoolerMaster case at NewEgg. I didn't read all of them, but none that I =
> read complained of a dead power switch. Some did say they felt the =
> Start button was flimsy and cheap feeling, but nobody had a dead one. I =
> don't personally know of anyone who has ever had a dead one in any new =
> case of any brand, although I certainly wouldn't say that it couldn't =
> happen. Obviously this one is not totally dead because it does turn on =
> the computer occasionally. =20
>
> Any thoughts?
>
> dj
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