RE: OEM vs Foglight
- From: Michael Dinh <mdinh@xxxxxxxxx>
- To: "'kylelf@xxxxxxxxx'" <kylelf@xxxxxxxxx>, "Joel.Patterson@xxxxxxxxxxx" <Joel.Patterson@xxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2011 15:01:00 -0700
FYI:
We use Confio here and it's a great product. You can also download the FREE
Lite version as well.
Mark the sales rep there is great to work with and if you want a referral then
just let me know.
Disclosure: I am not being compensated by any means nor have I been solicited
to say what I have said.
Michael Dinh : XIFIN
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From: oracle-l-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:oracle-l-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
Behalf Of kyle Hailey
Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2011 2:41 PM
To: Joel.Patterson@xxxxxxxxxxx
Cc: cicciuxdba@xxxxxxxxx; oracle-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: OEM vs Foglight
First, if you have the slightest interest in a desktop tool such as Spotlight I
recommend DB Optimizer which I feel is much more powerful and modern. I'm
biased as I worked on DB Optimizer at EMBT 2008-2010 but am no longer at EMBT
thus can say with a clear conscious that DB Optimizer is awesome. I also
worked at Quest on Spotlight. Spotlight was awesome 10 years ago when it came
out but now outdated - it drives me crazy when it's the only tool customers
have. I tried to modernize Spotlight immediately in
2001<https://sites.google.com/site/youvisualize/active-session-history> when I
worked at Quest. Quest wasn't interested and we quickly parted ways. I then
went to Oracle in 2002 and worked on a complete redesign of the performance
graphics, for example Top
Activity<https://sites.google.com/site/youvisualize/oem-10g-performance-pages---before-and-after>
screen. I found Oracle frustratingly slow and bloated at times so I went to
Embarcadero to work on a smaller faster product DB Optimizer. DB Optimizer
was a challenge as it had to work on not only Oracle but DB2, SQL Server and
Sybase in the same interface but it takes performance monitoring even farther,
runs faster and is a sinch to install. I think it came out awesome not to
mention the Visual SQL
Tuning<http://dboptimizer.com/2011/07/08/woohoo-vst-takes-the-next-step/>
stuff. DB Optimizer is primarily a desktop tool. DB Optimizer can be made to
collect into a shared repository 24x7 but that isn't it's forte. The realm of
24x7 mutli-target monitoring is the forte of Enterprise tools.
Enterprise tools for databases are either OEM, Foglight, Confio or Indepth. Of
these OEM and Foglight seem like the best. I've never used Foglight but from
the demo's I've seen on Quest's website it looks good and looks like they
understand the domain and have designed well for it. The biggest obstacle I've
heard is that Quest requires a binary to run on each target and the binary
depends on OS type, OS version and Oracle version so it can be quite a
management challenge. Quest bought Foglight back in 2001 time frame and was
basically boondoggled AFAIU. Quest then invested enormous resources to
structure Foglight into something usable. How far they have come I don't know.
The part I like is the Quest Performance Analyzer for Oracle. Quest had cool
videos on Perf Analyzer for Oracle online but I can't find them anymore -
strange.
I don't think there is a perfect enterprise Oracle monitoring solution. OEM is
nice - of course I like things which makes sense as I design parts, but other
parts drive me crazy and all parts tend to be slow and granular and the
framework is bloated. If I were a customer I'd definitely want to do a trial
run with Foglight on my systems.
Unfortunately the enterprise monitoring space is drying up and companies like
Quest and Embarcadero are cutting development resources back to a minimum.
Just found this link that echos this sentiments
http://www.infoworld.com/d/data-management/can-quest-foglight-hang-big-boys-601
from 5 years ago (take the comments about Foglight with a grain of salt as the
article is old)
The lack of decent tools to manage your databases on an enterprise level is
just staggering. It's hard to believe that nobody can cross the finish line on
delivering a monitoring solution.
I would love to create a better enterprise solution if I could find the
funding! :)
- Kyle
http://dboptimizer.com
On Wed, Jul 13, 2011 at 8:01 AM,
<Joel.Patterson@xxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:Joel.Patterson@xxxxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
IMHO,
OEM is "oracle's", so my analogy goes something like this: Its like gravity;
you can't resist, and oracle will put more a more into OEM sooner or later -
akin to Microsoft. (eg. You wanted to use WordPerfect and Lotus123, but in
the end there was only so much you can invest, and... eventually caved under
the weight created by Microsoft. That most people do not wish to learn
multiple programs, and thus it turns out that everyone else uses Word and Excel
- ipso facto, doesn't matter if one is better than another, Microsoft floated
to the top). I think that eventually, like this analogy, oracle is going to
make it a reality somehow that you want or wish you had OEM in house.
So, to continue, since Foglight for oracle is not cheap, having both is not
practical. Spend some extra money on DBOptimizer to go with the monitoring
tool.
Joel Patterson
Database Administrator
904 727-2546<tel:904%20727-2546>
________________________________
From: oracle-l-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:oracle-l-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
[mailto:oracle-l-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:oracle-l-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>] On
Behalf Of Guillermo Alan Bort
Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2011 10:36 AM
To: oracle-l-freelists
Subject: OEM vs Foglight
So, today we had a very boring and long presentation by Quest about foglight...
I must admit I spaced out 10 minutes in, so I honestly don't know what they are
offering... they are saying that their product is the best and I think it's a
lot cheaper that OEM... so my question goes out there to you, the community
whose opinion I respect. If you had the choice of staying with OEM or
implementing foglight, what would you do? why?
my curiosity tells me to go with spotlight just because it's something I don't
know... and I like to challenge myself... my lazy side is telling me to stick
with OEM which I know how to break and sometimes even how to fix...
My obsessive side is gathering all the information it can to make an informed
recommendation to management... so... here I am.
Thanks in advance
Alan.-
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