[opendtv] Re: Microtune MT2130 Tuner
- From: "John Willkie" <johnwillkie@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <opendtv@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Wed, 6 Dec 2006 12:01:32 -0800
Define temporary in the context of a day that has been celebrated somewhere
for almost 2000 years.
In context: how long has Christmas been "celebrated" in Japan? Are there
Christmas assemblages in Shinto shrines? How many people in Japan have
celebrated Christmas their entire life? What percentage of people (as
opposed to merchants) celebrate?
I can tell you that Christmas started becoming "vogue" in Japan in the late
1970's. ISTR reading of it in the LA Times in 1978 or 1979, and it was very
small then, but by the mid-1980's, it had had become widespread, just like
the "fad" of non-English speaking Japanese wearing t-shirts and sweatshirts
with bold nonsensical English language phrases. Many were perhaps given as
Christmas presents.
Compare that "fad" to how long it's been celebrated in, say, Italy. Even
some Communists celebrate Christmas, in a fashion.
John Willkie
> -----Original Message-----
> From: opendtv-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:opendtv-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
> On Behalf Of Bob Miller
> Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2006 11:53 AM
> To: opendtv@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: [opendtv] Re: Microtune MT2130 Tuner
>
> Christmas is a "fad" in Japan"????
>
> Definition of fad....
>
> "a temporary fashion, notion, manner of conduct, etc., esp. one
> followed enthusiastically by a group."
>
> Operating words, "temporary" and "group".
>
> Japan represents a very big group.
>
> And 400 years a very long "temporary".
>
> http://www.christmasarchives.com/wjapan.html
>
> "Francis Xavier was from Portugal in 1549, taught us Christianity
> about 400 years ago. It was the first experience of this for the
> Japanese and Christmas became popular throughout Japan from that time.
> The first recorded Christmas Mass was celebrated at Yamaguchi Church
> in 1552. Even today's there are 'KAKURE' (secret Christians), who hide
> that they are Christians, and they still use Latin when they sing
> Christmas carols. This style of celebrating Christmas has not changed
> since the custom began 400 years ago."
>
> Of course I was talking of the Christmas season in general and how
> many countries around the world see an increase in BUYING of things
> during this period no matter what the excuse. I didn't mean to start
> an argument about who officially celebrates Christmas in the official
> way.
>
> Bob Miller
>
> On 12/6/06, John Willkie <johnwillkie@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> > So, let me see. Bahrain, a "country" smaller than the city I am at this
> > moment in, Celebrates Christmas.
> >
> > You allege that China celebrates Christmas, but of course by your words,
> > they do not. Last time I checked, they had about half the world's
> > population. You equivocated on this point, Bob. How many TV stations
> in
> > China use the DVB spec?
> >
> > Christmas is a "fad" in Japan.
> >
> > How many of these countries around the world that you believe celebrate
> > Christmas have DTT systems based on the DVB standards? Will there be
> > millions of DTT boxes under Bahraini Christmas trees?
> >
> > Will there be millions and millions of DVB receivers sold for Christmas
> > presents in Brazil? How about Argentina?
> >
> > I just listed a few countries where Christmas is less prevalent than
> ATSC
> > countries. Do you believe that Hindis, Sikhs and Muslims are more
> likely to
> > celebrate Christmas in India than the average citizen in, say, Canada?
> > While India, in the post-Marxist world, is starting to thrive, the
> average
> > annual income for the country is still less than the average weekly
> income
> > in the U.S. I suspect that the few people there who celebrate Christmas
> > don't buy many HDTV sets.
> >
> > I have a bit of a perspective on this point, Bob. I live most of the
> time
> > in Mexico. Christmas is observed there, but not in the way that would
> lead
> > many Mexicans to put DTT systems out as presents on Christmas.
> Christmas
> > trees are just getting to be in vogue there among people; Christmas in
> > Mexico is more about the "reason for the season" than gifts. (Every
> time
> > the buses I ride in Mexico passes a Catholic church, many people on the
> bus
> > execute the "sign of the cross" just like my mom did when I was a mere
> > child.)
> >
> > You reach for low-hanging fruit, Bob, to "praise" DVB. You do this all
> the
> > time, and try to chime in on any remote topic to pimp what -- in the
> country
> > you live in -- is a dead letter. In the current context, you are
> actually
> > damning DVB with faint praise.
> >
> > Also, as to the TR101-290 spec, it actually has much to say about what a
> > receiver should be able to do, but can't use RF planning factors, since
> they
> > are different from region to region and country to country.
> >
> > John Willkie
> >
> > P.S. I note you didn't respond to how many people in France are able to
> get
> > HDTV terrestrially. Do you think that the French people -- as opposed
> to
> > the nomenclatura -- are interested in 'quality?'
> >
> >
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: opendtv-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:opendtv-
> bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
> > > On Behalf Of Bob Miller
> > > Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2006 10:08 AM
> > > To: opendtv@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > Subject: [opendtv] Re: Microtune MT2130 Tuner
> > >
> > > My daughter brought home a friend from college for Thanksgiving, a
> > > Fulbright scholar from Bahrain. They celebrate Christmas there and she
> > > is a Bahai Iranian.
> > >
> > > Japan is big on Christmas. They probably spend more than Germany.
> > > Russia is big on Christmas with gifts given on New Years Eve. They are
> > > thirteen days behind us though as to Christmas.
> > >
> > > Taiwan is working on making Christmas a holiday.China has their Spring
> > > Festival (Chinese New year) at the end of January which is the atheist
> > > answer to Christmas there though traditional Christmas is celebrated
> > > by some.
> > >
> > > India celebrates Christmas and it is a national holiday. They
> > > celebrate it like many of us as a secular event, an excuse for
> > > spending on presents and good times.
> > >
> > > It is the season to spend in most of the places you list which was my
> > > point.
> > >
> > > This I know John.
> > >
> > > And thanks for your continued instructions in the art of life.
> > >
> > >
> > > Bob Miller
> > >
> > > On 12/6/06, John Willkie <johnwillkie@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> > > > You mean that ETSI hasn't published a TR to deal with receiver
> issues
> > > akin
> > > > to the TR101-290 for transport stream issues?
> > > >
> > > > And, you mean that Christmas is celebrated widely in, say India,
> China,
> > > > Japan, Taiwan, Russia and the middle East? Somehow, that's more
> than
> > > half
> > > > the world's population.
> > > >
> > > > Bob, it's better to speak of what you know, or risk showing
> ignorance.
> > > >
> > > > John Willkie
> > > >
> > > > P.S. What percentage of those French households can receive
> terrestrial
> > > > HDTV? Do you think that they lose something by down rezzing?
> > > >
> > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > From: opendtv-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:opendtv-
> > > bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
> > > > > On Behalf Of Bob Miller
> > > > > Sent: Tuesday, December 05, 2006 9:56 PM
> > > > > To: opendtv@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > > > Subject: [opendtv] Re: Microtune MT2130 Tuner
> > > > >
> > > > > Or that since DVB-T/H receivers meet the market place spec and
> since
> > > > > there is a lot of competition if you don't want to be dog meat
> next
> > > > > week your receiver better be as good or better than others.
> > > > >
> > > > > This Christmas season is going to be gangbusters around the world
> for
> > > > > DVB-T/H receivers. Come the spring it could be truly amazing.
> France
> > > > > has 20% household penetration in 18 months in the half of the
> country
> > > > > they have covered.
> > > > >
> > > > > Bob Miller
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------
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