[opendtv] Re: Delay

  • From: "Bob Miller" <robmxa@xxxxxxxxx>
  • To: opendtv@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
  • Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2006 11:03:43 -0500

On 12/10/06, Manfredi, Albert E <albert.e.manfredi@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Bob Miller bwrote:

>> Instead, you obsess over the modulation type.
> And I will continue to.

Which is why you sound like you're stuck in the mud, to me, with no hope
of finding a way out. The technical problems are solvable, and have
largely been solved. The political or otherwise mysterious ones are
proving a lot more difficult.

It's really exasperating to hear this facile relapse to modulation
problems from 1999 used as an excuse, especially when it comes from
those who could make a real difference in the success of DTT. "Let's
keep lulling them to sleep with tired old cornball excuses." And
especially when existing state of the art products stubbornly don't
appear on store shelves.

> You are saying that your two friends bought integrated
> sets. Do they use them for OTA recepetion at all?

One of them I mentioned recently. He got Verizon FiOS and uses it
exclusively for broadband Internet access, and ATSC exclusively for TV.

The other has Cox cable, but is not paying for HD programming. He got a
new wide screen set with integrated receiver just last week, his first
HDTV set, and wants to use the OTA tuner to get his HDTV programming
without having to increase his subscription fee. (He was also
complaining strongly about "panorama" mode and its obvious distortions.)

Another friend at work buys the HD package from Cox. He wonders why
anyone would do anything else. (Of course, none of the OTA broadcasters
are telling him anything different. Isn't it curious how HD radio ads

Then I have two neighbors who are similarly using ATSC as an HD source,
but they also subscribe to DBS.

A third such neighbor just moved out on Thanksgiving, and his
replacement promptly removed the OTA antenna (but not the dish), and
called Cox to get hooked up to cable. It was one of the very first
things he did. To their credit, Cox did come out in a flash. Hook them
up and reel them in.

I have another neighbor who is a Cox customer, but also has two OTA TVs
in the house. It took a long time and many different sessions to explain
to him that DTT was available, that STBs could be bought to retain use
of his old sets, and that STBs were not expensive. But of course, I'm
not the one who should be explaining these things, time and again. (He's
one of these brilliant but flaky guys who has a hard time internalizing
things that don't fit his preconceived notions. So you have to repeat it
over and over.)

Sounds like someone I know.

My brother-in-law also uses ATSC as an adjunct to DBS.

By the way, do not assume that every household buys just one DTV
receiver. Bob. You are probably inflating your assumed penetration
numbers with this technique. We have two DTV receivers, for instance.

You only have two? Some of the biggest boosters of OTA 8-VSB on
AVSForum who will tell you they have no problems receiving a signal
will then mention that the latest of 9 8-VSB receivers they just
bought is the best yet.

Yes my numbers are exaggerated by the fact that some homes have more
than one receiver. Of course if you went by the strict number of
receivers sold in say France in the 58% of the country that is covered
and then compared it to households you would come up with an
astounding 48% penetration in 18 months. I took the official number
given in the article of 20%.

In the UK you have 17 million receivers sold by the end of this month
but they suggest that only 7-8 million households are OTA only. Of
course many more households have OTA  but no one gives a number. In
fact probably a lot of households in the UK have satellite and two
Freeview receivers as well.

Some of my numbers exaggerate and some underestimate. On the average
though, since I am biased, my numbers are probably more exaggerated.
However having many homes with multiple receivers is pretty good to

In the US we have everyone exaggerating the importance of coverage and
the number of TV stations on the air with HDTV OTA and never mention
the fact that no one is watching OTA but 5 of your friends.

I have said that OTA DTV is not driving HDTV set sales though that was
one of the biggest and in reality was the biggest reason the US could
NOT consider a different modulation in 2000 or even in 1998.

HD content on OTA was supposed to drive HDTV set sales. Any delay
would hurt the CEA manufacturers who stood to make billions from high
mark-up HDTV sets. CEA manufacturers were in control of the process of
picking our new digital modulation since broadcasters has abdicated
the process.

Well it seems that HD is not even driving the sale of HDTV sets.


And the numbers would seem to be about to get worse than the pathetic
40-50% of HDTV owners who have an HD service of any kind.


"And, perhaps worse, the research firm said only 25 percent of current
HDTV shoppers said the main reason they wanted to buy one was to watch

Only 25%.

And what percentage of those will go to the trouble of hooking up or
installing a roof top antenna. What percentage of that 25% even have a
clue about OTA???

OTA lies dieing on the street and everyone just walks by.

Bob Miller


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