[opendtv] Re: China OKs its own terrestrial DTV spec
- From: "peter wilson" <peter.wilson@xxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <opendtv@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Wed, 13 Sep 2006 08:38:58 +0100
Hi All,
Universal sets are already available; this link is to my local computer
shop. http://www.novatech.co.uk/novatech/specpage.html?nov-lcd37d
<http://www.novatech.co.uk/novatech/specpage.html?nov-lcd37d&P=0> &P=0
It probably costs money to make a single system one nowadays.
BR,
Peter
_____
From: opendtv-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:opendtv-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
Behalf Of johnwillkie@xxxxxxx
Sent: 09 September 2006 06:50
To: opendtv@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [opendtv] Re: China OKs its own terrestrial DTV spec
Broadcasters in China? I haven't paid much attention lately, but last time I
checked there was China Central TV's many channels and regional TV stations.
However, they, unlike a few newspapers, are instruments of the Communist
Party.
You know, the same people who permit "votes" for only one candidate per
office, the official party candidate.
Aren't a whole lot of DVB and ATSC receivers (like the ILO I mentioned the
other day) made in China? It doesn't seem too much of a leap for them to
make universal sets, particularly when one takes into account the (lack of)
IP protection in China, "low cost" of DVB-T chipsets, and economies of
scale.
OTOH, main transmitters could be COFDM, and translators could be 8-VSB.
China has of recent years been undergoing many changes in attempts to keep
people from illegally migrating from the poorer rural areas to the more
properous cities. TV there tends to serve the interests of the state.
It's not as if these decisions are made in public,via due process bodies ...
John Willkie
-----Original Message-----
From: bob@xxxxxxxxxx
To: opendtv@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Fri, 8 Sep 2006 10:15 PM
Subject: [opendtv] Re: China OKs its own terrestrial DTV spec
I think this reporter cut and pasted parts of a past story into this one and
got it wrong. China was going to go with a dual standard but took some time
and come up with a compromise which incorporates some of the VSB stuff but
is still a multi-carrier TD-OFDM modulation. Broadcasters are not going to
be using a single carrier for rural areas and a multi-carrier for cities. I
think the VSB part is more face saving to get this done. Notice no one is
talking about dual receivers or broadcasters having to chose what modulation
to use anymore which they were doing in the summer.
I thought it would have been interesting to see them go head to head and was
disappointed when they compromised. The VSB had mobile test in one city and
fixed in some others but the DMB-T test were taking place in 30 or more
cities. If they had gone head to head no one would have implemented the VSB.
As it is I don't think you will find any help from whatever was grafted onto
the DMB-T from VSB to make it CDMB-T/H. Would like to know what it is
though. I think the VSB side caved because they knew that if they didn't win
it all and were part of a dual standard they were history. Same as would
have happened if Sinclair had been successful in getting COFDM allowed in
the US. 8-VSB advocates fought very hard against that because they knew that
8-VSB stood no chance against DVB-T.
Though I think the VSB system in China was far better than what we have and
it would be great if we could use it here.
Bob Miller
Manfredi, Albert E wrote:
> Some time ago, I posted an article which explained that the Chinese DTV
> standard was developed by two universities, one which developed a VSB
> scheme, the other a time-synchronous COFDM scheme. The two were merged
> into one standard. It looks like this combined standard has been
> approved.
>
> The new aspect of this story is that, apparently, the VSB portion of the
> standard must be used for fixed reception, and the COFDM portion, which
> seems to be only time-divided COFDM, is only meant for portable handheld
> devices. I hadn't gotten this impression last time, but it makes sense
> if the COFDM part of the standard is only for time-synchronous
> transmissions (a la DVB-H, is my assumption). Here's the quote:
>
> "The resulting spec is less a combination of the universities' work than
> a coexistence of two modulation schemes--Tsinghua's time-domain
> synchronous orthogonal frequency-division multiplexing and Jiaotong's
> vestigial sideband modulation. Jiaotong's technology will be used for
> broadcasts to fixed TVs; Tsinghua's technology will be more suitable for
> mobile terminals in urban settings."
>
> The good news for ATSC, I think, is that this means that many more smart
> people will be looking for equalizer and tuner technology improvements
> aimed specifically at VSB reception. What's more, the manufacturers
> designing and building VSB receivers for the Chinese home market will
> likely also be building ATSC receivers. At least some of their
> innovations will probably also be applicable to ATSC.
>
> Bert
>
> -------------------------------
> China OKs its own terrestrial DTV spec
>
> Mike Clendenin
> (09/04/2006 9:00 AM EDT)
> URL: http://www.eetimes.com/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=192500943
>
> Shanghai, China -- China's standards body gave the thumbs-up to a
> homegrown terrestrial digital-TV technology last week, saying broadcasts
> would begin next August. The decision clears the path for China's effort
> to transition hundreds of millions of households to free-to-air digital
> broadcasts. But it leaves a fuzzy picture for the mobile-TV segment,
> where a handful of standards still compete.
>
> China wants to see widespread use of digital TV by the 2008 Summer
> Olympics in Beijing. For televisions, that will be easier to do. A few
> chip makers, armed with early drafts of the standard, known as Digital
> Multimedia Broadcast-Terrestrial/Handheld, are already putting the
> finishing touches on silicon and reference designs, and they are
> confident about winning design-ins for set-top boxes, personal media
> players and notebook PCs (via USB dongles) by later this fall.
>
> But there is uncertainty about whether DMB-T/H will be ready for the
> small screens of handsets by the Olympics. That could leave the door
> open to competing specs, such as Europe's DVB-Handheld, the MediaFLO
> format pitched by Qualcomm Inc., and two formats announced in China in
> recent weeks: Terrestrial-Mobile Multimedia Broadcasting, a derivative
> of South Korea's Terrestrial-Digital Multimedia Broadcasting, and STiMi
> (short for satellite and terrestrial interaction multimedia). The T-MMB
> and STiMi camps plan to vie for a shot to prove their worth at the 2008
> Games.
>
> The DMB-T/H camp has a handset prototype, "but it is in the very early
> stages," said Xingjun Wang, a Tsinghua University professor who had a
> hand in hammering out the standard. "For commercial-grade [versions], we
> still need a low-power chip set, and that is under design. So it will
> not be easy to make that [Olympics] deadline, if you also consider the
> testing and certifications that are needed."
>
> Two days after China approved the standard, Analog Devices Inc. and
> Legend Silicon said they would team up for a three-chip DMB-T/H solution
> comprising a tuner and Blackfin decoder from ADI and a demodulator from
> Legend. While clam-shell-style-phone support may be a ways off, ADI is
> optimistic that the higher levels of integration needed for bulkier
> smart phones will happen this winter, with hardware prototypes emerging
> next summer.
>
> "It will be in plenty of time for people to say 'Yep, it works', then
> kick over to mass production so there can be millions of units in the
> market for Chinese New Year 2008," said Dave Robertson, product line
> director for high-speed signal processing at ADI.
>
> Unlike Europe's distinct flavors for DVB--one for terrestrial, one for
> handheld--China's DMB-T/H was designed for both fixed and mobile
> terminals and will eventually serve more than half of China's TV
> viewers, especially those in suburban and rural areas. DMB-T/H is an
> outgrowth of work at Tsinghua University (Beijing) and Jiaotong
> University (Shanghai), each of which had hoped to forge the sole
> technology, but neither of which had the technological or political
> muscle to pull it off.
>
> The resulting spec is less a combination of the universities' work than
> a coexistence of two modulation schemes--Tsinghua's time-domain
> synchronous orthogonal frequency-division multiplexing and Jiaotong's
> vestigial sideband modulation. Jiaotong's technology will be used for
> broadcasts to fixed TVs; Tsinghua's technology will be more suitable for
> mobile terminals in urban settings. China will deploy digital TV over
> VHFIII and UHF spectrum ranges using an 8-MHz channel bandwidth.
>
> Offshore-based chip companies that have expressed interest in the
> Chinese standard thus far include ADI, STMicroelectronics and Conexant.
> Legend has had an inside track on the spec because of its close
> relationship with Tsinghua University, which is an investor, and so has
> Shanghai High Definition Digital Technology, which is affiliated with
> Jiaotong University. Other Chinese companies designing chips for DMB-T/H
> include Hangzhou-based Guoxin Technology and Shanghai-based Chinips
> Electronics. In handhelds, Microtune said it plans to expand its mobile
> tuner product line to include DMB-T/H.
>
> Some set-top-box makers and TV manufacturers, including Haier, Samsung
> and LG, have turned out prototypes based on DMB-T/H. Trials for fixed
> TVs and nomadic TVs have been ongoing for at least two years in more
> than 30 Chinese cities.
>
> By 2008, Tsinghua's Wang expects that DMB-T/H (whose name is being
> changed to CDMB-T/H to reflect the standard's Chinese origins) will be
> established in fixed TVs and nomadic terminals of the type used in taxis
> and trains. But so far only China Putian has a prototype of a handset
> supporting the spec.
>
> That should leave the door open for T-DMB, a South Korean digital
> multimedia broadcast standard that is being heavily promoted in China
> and already is in trials, said ADI's Robertson. "If all the other
> standards sputtered, and China needed something to deploy in volume with
> the lowest risk, it would be T-DMB," he said.
>
> DMB-T/H is theoretically more technologically compatible with Europe's
> DVB-H than with the Korean format; for instance, DMB-T/H and DVB-H use
> 8-MHz channel widths, vs. 1 MHz for T-DMB. But early lobbying by South
> Korean interests is giving that country's spec a solid foothold in
> China.
>
> "DVB-H is probably not going to be used here," said Wilbert Zou, an
> analyst at Beijing-based telecom consultancy BDA Research. "The picture
> is also uncertain for Qualcomm's MediaFLO."
>
> Decisions on standards adoption are heavily influenced by China's State
> Administration of Radio Film and Television, which favors DMB-T/H and
> T-DMB over DVB-H and MediaFLO. That doesn't bode well for the latter
> two, though in China's opaque decision-making process fortunes can
> quickly turn.
>
> Last month's rollouts of the T-MMB and STiMi mobile-TV technologies only
> complicate matters. Few technical details are available for the new
> formats, which are supported by academic-industrial coalitions in China.
>
> T-MMB was jointly developed by Beijing-based software firm Nufrontsoft,
> China's Communication University, and Southeast University. It is
> supposedly compatible with Digital Audio Broadcasting (DAB)-based T-DMB.
> The spec supports frequencies from 30 MHz to 3 GHz, and a prototype chip
> is ready, with samples expected in 2007, Nufrontsoft said.
>
> STiMi was developed by the Academy of Broadcast Science, part of a
> government ministry that regulates broadcasting in China. STiMi supports
> the S- and UHF/VHF bands and will use both satellites and terrestrial
> relays to implement coverage. Little more is known about the technology.
>
>
> Chinese officials said they hope to finish trials with the new
> technologies by the end of 2006 and to move into commercial trials in
> 2007. Since the government has officially approved DMB-T/H, it could be
> tough for other domestic rivals to win out.
>
> -- Cai Yan contributed to this story.
>
> All material on this site Copyright 2006 CMP Media LLC. All rights
> reserved.
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