[opendtv] Re: 480i 16:9 with pillarboxed image

  • From: "TLM" <TLM@xxxxxxxxxx>
  • To: <opendtv@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Thu, 27 Dec 2012 13:02:34 -0800

Hmmm....I've forgotten almost everything I know (knew?) about Table 3.

I found this in one Wiki article:

"If 16:9 = 1.777...Then I would think 853x480 would be the most accurate
resolution for widescreen 480p
 
853x480 = 1.77708333...
 854x480 = 1.7791666...
 852x480 = 1.775
 
It just so happens that most EDTVs (plasma) have a native resolution of
853x480."  [TLM - Note that that Wiki writer used the term "EDTV".]

But this writer failed to finish his point and possible 853 suggestion by
not clearly documenting if they were talking about production, emission, or
display.  I am and always have been for deinterlacing interlaced content
before compression when going into a compressed emission stream.  But if you
look at the entire glass-to-glass system and start separating acquisition
and production formats from emission formats and then display formats, then
this may get a little more complex.

Certainly 480p for emission remains interesting (quite efficient, actually),
and we know now that EDTV has largely gone by the wayside for display
surfaces.  All new CE display products now decode the compressed stream and
map it onto the progressivly scanned/updated HD display surface, and I
believe that most new CE devices are 16:9 (actually at COSTCO I just saw
some Philips & VIZIO products that were even wider - CEA861 or 2560 x 1080 I
think!), but would all install and future consumer decoders support
ingestion of 853 by 480P (yes, I know that MPEG-2 and AVC/HEVC/H.264/H.265
can do it)?

What does Table 3 have to say about all of that?

Before dealving into the other points that Craig brings up I suggest the
people take a look at what the DVB is doing on the CODEC front, and with
HDR, HFR, UHDTV, and 3DTV Phases X etc.  There is a great body of work
underway, and I would think that the world will embrace the depth and
breadth of the fruits of their labors.

-----Original Message-----
From: opendtv-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:opendtv-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
Behalf Of Craig Birkmaier
Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2012 3:45 AM
To: opendtv@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [opendtv] Re: 480i 16:9 with pillarboxed image

At 9:25 PM +1100 12/27/12, Ciril & Anita Kosorok wrote:
>"Then, if the image is 4:3, as it often is with SD material, just 
>transmit two black pillars. So even people who don't have AFD can set 
>their monitors to 16:9 and leave it there. You lose a slight amount of 
>horizontal res that way, in 4:3 material, but hard to notice. Most 4:3 
>material is way low res anyway."
>
>It's been done this way in Australia since the commencement of DVB-T 
>broadcasting; way back in the year 2000.

Now it is time for the really important NEXT STEP.

Deinterlace all of these old shows and transmit as 480P.

640 x 480 for 4:3 source

853 x 480 for 16:9 source

And the most important step...


Replace MPEG-2 with h.264 - or by the time broadcasters get their act
together, h.265.

And while we are at it, include higher frame rates for sports - at least
72P, and possibly 120P.

And make all of this variable, based on the bandwidth available for
transmission. Thus you could have 853 x 480 @ 72P or 120P for lower
bandwidth channels, 1280 x 720 @ 72P etc. And you could vary frame rates
based on scene content.

For what it is worth, the OTT streaming services already do most of this,
except for variable frame rates, using h.264.

Looks like the moving picture industry is finally waking up form its hundred
year sleep...

High Frame Rate-What Is Enough?

<http://www.tvtechnology.com/article/high-frame-rate-what-is-enough/216876>h
ttp://www.tvtechnology.com/article/high-frame-rate-what-is-enough/216876

Regards
Craig


 
 
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