[lit-ideas] Re: Yes, We Have No [Mus(ae) Sapientum]
- From: Michael Chase <goya@xxxxxxx>
- To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Sat, 04 Sep 2004 11:08:44 -0700
Le 3 sept. 04, =E0 17:50, Jlsperanza@xxxxxxx a =E9crit :
>
>
> In a message dated 9/2/2004 2:25:32 AM Eastern Standard Time,=20
> goya@xxxxxxx
> writes:
> I hope everyone realizes the revolutionary consequences of this=3D20=3D=
> discovery that Musa really means banana. All references in Greek=3D20
> literature to "Muses", usually interpreted as female protectresses=20
> of=3D20
> the arts, are in fact to be translated as "bananas". Hesiod's=20
> Theogony=3D20=3D
>
>
> ----
>
> Indeed.
>
> Revolutionary, and possibly true.
>
> Note that the pillars in the Acropolis -- the Kariatides -- are the =20=
> Mousai,
> the Muses -- long associated with "Wisdom" (Sapientia) -
M.C. Although I usually don't get very far when I ask JLS the following=20=
question, I'll try once again=A0: what is the source for this=20
information? It seems to me patently false. The nine Muses (Calliope,=20
Clio, Euterpe, Terpsichore, Erato, Melpomene, Thalia, Polyhymnia,=20
Urania) were each the protectress of a different art, and in artistic=20
representations they all bear symbols that are iconographically=20
distinct and enable their identification.
It is *a priori* rather unlikely that delicate, artistic young =
females=20
who spend their time dancing barefoot through meadows are also going to=20=
be holding up buildings on their heads, don't you think? In fact, the=20
origin and meaning of the Caryatides is likely to be much more prosaic.=20=
Here's the relevant part of the entry s.v. in Smith's Dictionary of=20
Greek and Roman Antiquities (London, 1875, p. 243):
"Caryae was a city in Arcadia, near the Laconian border=A0...its=20=
inhabitants joined the Persians after the battle of Thermopylae...on=20
the defeat of the Persians the allied Greeks destroyed the town, slew=20
the men, and led the women into captivity...as male figures=20
representing Persians were afterwards employed...instead of columns in=20=
artchitecture, so Praxiteles and other Athenian artists employed female=20=
figures for the same purpose, intending them...to commemorate the=20
disgrace of the Caryatides, or women of Caryae (Vitruvius 1, 1, 5=A0;=20
Pliny H.N. 36, 45; 11)".
For more recent defenses of Virtuvius' viewpoint, see H. Plommer,=20
=93=A0Vitruvius and the origin of caryatids=A0=94 Journal of Hellenic =
Studies=20
1979 XCIX : 97-102; Michael Vickers, =93=A0Persepolis, Vitruvius and the=20=
Erechtheum Caryatids. The iconography of medism and servitude=A0", Revue=20=
archeologique 1985 : 3-28.
>
> I wonder if the different species of banana that there are are _also_ =20=
> called
> "musa"?
M.C. Yes. Musa japonica, Musa cavendishii (=3D the variety from Ecuador=20=
and Colombia), Musa paradisiaca (known in Mexico as platano macho; it=20
needs cooking before you can eat it).
>
> I
Best, Mike.
Michael Chase
(goya@xxxxxxxxxxx)
CNRS UPR 76
7, rue Guy Moquet
Villejuif 94801
France
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