[lit-ideas] Re: The continuation of Realpolitik -- a rant
- From: "David Wright" <wright@xxxxxxxx>
- To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Fri, 23 May 2008 23:39:34 -0500
What, at the root, I'm saying is that behaviour supported by a
diseducated but semi-populist group does not justify concomitant,
unethical behaviour.
To put it into simplistic terms, it is not cool to say:
"I refrain from eating meat, so, like, I can drive a car to work every
day."
(almost) Ignoring, but pointing out, phrases like this: "Can all you
think about is money?" or "And houses produce actually more GW gases than
cars."
an obnoxious so-and-so, I know,
d.
Irene wrote:
How can you compare driving to killing animals in unbelievably cruel
ways? Are you just another sheep? Can all you think about is
money? What about the water that goes into raising cattle, the
millions of tons of manure, the mad cow disease (which I won't even
go into where that comes from), the methane that's produced.
Methane is 20 times more potent than CO2. And houses produce
actually more GW gases than cars. I'm not a proponent of cars but
you're saying that until the cars go we have to eat meat? Are you
kidding?
--- On Sat, 5/24/08, David Wright <wright@xxxxxxxx> wrote:
From: David Wright <wright@xxxxxxxx>
Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: The continuation of Realpolitik -- a
rant
To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Date: Saturday, May 24, 2008, 3:59 AM
Religion is what we choose to venerate. You venerate a certain
lifestyle. Call yourself a Jain, if you will, though it would be
as false as your claim to veggiehood -- you do drive after all,
don't you? That is not a rhetorical question.. Don't take it
personally. I expect it from the vast majority. I know
individuals for whom science is a religion. It is the difference
between critical thought and reactionary belief.
For example, "I do this 'cause it makes me feel good but I still
do this, that, and the other thing even if it's genuinely bad; I
just ignore the inconvenient stuff by justifying it through my
religion/belief system."
spirituality - the selfishly exclusive reliugion of the modern
individual,
d.
P.S. Religion = Spirituality = My Way or the Highway. That is to
say, that 'spirituality' is simply a way of saying I reject all
the stuff I disagree with, so that I can worship myself. It is
much more comfortable that way...
Irene:
I'm not sure what you mean by vegetarianism being a
religion. Maybe you need to define religion. Vegetarianism
is a choice in what form one takes one's calories. For some
there is also a spiritual component to it, but spirituality
is hardly religion. In some ways spirituality is the
opposite of religion. A plant based diet is extremely good
for the planet, but, as you say, meat is what most everyone
wants.
You're right that vegetable based 'meat' is energy intensive,
and it's not what grows in nature, but it's still a plant
food which makes it *much* easier on the environment than
live cattle. Worth noting is that the way agribusiness does
meat is not what grows in nature either. I personally don't
buy soy/veggie burgers except on rare occasion. Too
salty, too processed, plus I just never think of them.
--- On Sat, 5/24/08, David Wright <wright@xxxxxxxx> wrote:
From: David Wright <wright@xxxxxxxx>
Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: The continuation of Realpolitik
-- a rant
To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Date: Saturday, May 24, 2008, 1:54 AM
I understand the sentiment, however, the impressive
millions/billions figures you're throwing around are
true only if almost everyone in the west stops consuming
meat to such an extreme. At the moment, the meat that
veggies aren't eating is discarded or rendered into dog
food.
It is only a miniscule percentage of veggies that
actually engage in an ethically sound lifestyle. Most
still drive to their overpriced yuppie stores, buy "I'm A
Cool Vegetarian!" t-shirts, eat miso all the way from
Japan, and bamboo-fabric laptop cases. Transcending the
-isms also includes transcending consumerism. This
includes the massive veggie market for processed food --
Amy's, Yve's, Mcartney's, and the rest, that are shipped
all around the world. We also have to consider the
flyers veggie activists hand out, the flights and long
drives they take to inter/national veggie conventions...I
could go on, and on, and...
abandoning all religions, including Vegstafarianism
d.
Andy: It absolutely changes everything. It
stops torturing animals horrifically. It saves
millions if not billions of *tons* of water. I
saves the soil and it results in a lot more food
for everybody. Meat is natural, but there is
nothing natural about today's meat. You're
right, there's no such thing as a no impact man.
But there could be a minimal or low impact man,
and bicycles are definitely the way to do it.
Transcending isms and personal freedom sounds
good, but it's just an excuse to eat meat and 'do
your thing'. And maybe in a world of 6.6 billion
and growing on a shrinking planet, eat, drink and
be merry is all that's possible now. But just
call it the ism that it is, which is
selfish-ism. You'll have 6.599 billion
companions. They just won't be as honest as you
will be.
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