Interesting. My initial response to this thread was that I didn't disagree with Irene's assessment, and whenever I do that I suspect I am becoming psychotic. Upon reflection (and relief) I determined that I would never have written what she did. While I don't use Facebook, I have tried it several times and didn't find "those things of value" that Julie did. Had I, I might have pursued it a bit further. Susan is on it and enjoys it for some of the reasons others have mentioned and tells me if she runs across anything I should know. I suspect none of us has the time or inclination to keep up with all of the technological innovations being advanced almost every year. Ursula posted her note from her iPad. I am not critical of her or anyone else who has one. I'm sure they are very nice, but I don't have one. This note will come from my laptop. Susan, who asks my help if her desktop or laptop computers get cranky has just acquired an iPod, but that is only because she totaled her 2005 Subaru and acquired a 2012 Elantra which doesn't have room for all her CDs. The salesman explained that an iPod can be "easily" integrated into the Elantra's sound system; so last night she began loading her music onto a version 5 iPod what fits into a tiny compartment in front of her gear shift. I on the other hand shuddered, went downstairs and kissed the hood of my 2002 Jeep Liberty. Lawrence From: lit-ideas-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:lit-ideas-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Julie Krueger Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2011 7:06 AM To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: The Medium is the Message I often think of FB as a way to send a postcard, electronically. Just drop a line about something I'm doing or found interesting, or share a bit of music or art, note a book or an idea I find worthwhile. It serves, for me, a much different use from what eMail does. In addition, I get to hear those things of value from strangers (or acquaintances) around the globe that I would never, ever otherwise encounter. Julie Krueger On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 8:35 AM, Ursula Stange <ursula@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote: Well, Andy did begin by saying her assessment was based only on vicarious experience. If not misrepresented, this kind of "here's what I think" isn't wrong on the face of it. On top of that, she's not entirely wrong anyway. Facebook doesn't really lend itself to engaged discussion. It's more like meeting people on the street, sharing a joke or a book review or a comment on current affairs and then moseying along. (Very enjoyable if you choose your street wisely.) Another part of the Facebook experience I like is the eavesdropping aspect. Some of my best former students have become Facebook friends and, while they talk mainly to their contemporaries, I get to listen in and stay informed about their grad school experiences, their travels and their engagement with the wider world, all without any obligation to comment or acknowledge. My own children are opposed to Facebook, but there is a whole subgroup of farther-afield relatives who keep me informed of family doings and post pictures of their children and their travels and, here also, I find enjoyment with no obligation to comment or acknowledge. Additionally, I get to learn something about their interests In and opinions about the social, economic and political currents swirling around us. I'm their distant (they're mostly American) aunt or aunt-in-law and most would never write more to me than a Christmas card. So this Facebook connection is a real treat. For the past fifteen years, the four of us in my immediate family have had an email group to which we sometimes write longish letters about our doings or announcements of upcoming personal events but, just as often, send links to articles or web pages that have amused us or outraged us or informed us (kind of like leaving a magazine folded out to a great article for others in the household). It's informal and there is no obligation to respond to everything but I wouldn't trade that fifteen year archive for anything. It's a part of who we all are, indivdually and together. After all these years, my Lit-ideas archive feels kind of like that. Among the Lit-ideas friends now on Facebook, I continue to find a wealth of good notions, stimulating music, intriguing literary craftsmanship, sane political and social commentary and just plain fun. Sent from my kitchen...where my iPad lives, Ursula On 2011-10-25, at 8:45 AM, John McCreery <john.mccreery@xxxxxxxxx> wrote: There you go again, Andy, pontificating about something you know, at best, second hand. And in this case, the fault is particularly egregious, since trying out Facebook for a week or two to see how people actually use it is free. All it costs is a little time. Why, pray tell, do you think that anyone should pay the slightest attention to what you say? Except, of course, for the irritation felt on encountering mindless babble? Grumpy in Yokohama, John On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 9:31 PM, Andy <mimi.erva@xxxxxxxxx> wrote: I understand that Facebook seems to be absorbing a lot of conversational energy. Just some thoughts, but first a disclaimer. I don't have a Facebook account, have never had one, and don't participate as a 'friend' on any other Facebook account, including those of relatives. For what it's worth, my understanding of Facebook is that it's all about posting pictures of how much fun you're having. It's not about having fun, it's about proving you're having fun, especially for the younger crowd. Based on my vicarious understanding, I can't imagine having an intelligent conversation on Facebook. Certainly I couldn't have one with my relatives (and that's with two nephews in med school), or for that matter with most of my flesh and blood friends. Lit ideas people who have Facebook accounts are certainly excepted, but generally Facebook to me is a pure pomo experience, reality as if. Worse, it's a reflection of the general dumbing down of everything, a great big huge Twitter with pictures. 'Reality as if' requires no depth of understanding, which would make Facebook and Twitter the media for the times. A vicarious understanding, yes, but I think unfortunately accurate. Andy -- John McCreery The Word Works, Ltd., Yokohama, JAPAN Tel. +81-45-314-9324 <tel:%2B81-45-314-9324> jlm@xxxxxxxxxxxx http://www.wordworks.jp/