Maybe I'm missing a lot, but I keep waiting for Taylor to say something new. The framework, ie, the value system wherein or whereby we find our self-identity is nothing more than the world we're born into -- or so I take it. It seems no different than the Heideggerian always-already world from which and in which and through which we interpret the world and ourselves. Apostasy is a rare occurrence among human beings. That all human beings work within a value system, usually the one given them by their immediate culture, doesn't surprise me as it seems to surprise Taylor -- or maybe it doesn't surprise him, maybe he's just making sure that we understand this ground on which he builds his castle. Maybe he's going to get into the question that interests me, how is change possible? What causes people to shift their moral perspectives, even if ever so slightly. I suspect it's good old pragmatism. We'll see. Mike Geary Never sure I didn't miss something. Or as Rumsfeld would have it: I don't know what I don't know that I don't know.