It's amazing that, witnessing as we are the clash of western civilisation -- with anything nonwestern and uncivilized -- we have this list discussing on the size of the Old Greeks. I mean, who cares. In any case, two classical quotes: * re: sandals: Mr. Ramos suggests we check about relics of sandals. One problem with that is evidenced by Theophrastus (Loeb Library). In his "Characters" he has the 'bad taste' man as _always_ wearing sandals one size bigger than they fit. -- I'll try and find the quote if you insist. * re: sandals. Corolary problem: the nails: The Spartans were criticised for _not_ wearing sandals, and in general taking little care of things like foot plant and nails. They are described as 'dirty' by most Athenians. When this German photographer looked for a "Spartan ideal" in modern Italy, he photographed many 'ephebes', and the photographs were pretty successful at the time. Until Roland Barthes had a close look at them, and found that the nails of the 'ephebes' left a lot to be desired (*qua* nails). The issue is important enough to merit a whole section in Ovid, "Ars amatoria" (The 'tekhne erotike' of the old Greeks). Ovid goes at great lengths describing the seduction 'strategies' for the female -- how to catch a male in a Greek theatre, etc. -- I was more interesting in focusing in his advice for the males, and again, that leaves a lot to be desired. Basically, his main advice is that the male takes good care of his nails, since they show (when you use sandals). -- Again, I'll try and find the quote, when you don't insists. Cheers, J. L. Speranza "Greek" archeologist **************************************Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001)