Marlena:<Glad the hospice is attempting to keep her comfortable. That, indeed is palliative care, but normally they would try to spoon feed or give a little water as part of palliative care - but the judge denied that."> If you give water or food by mouth to a person in a PVS, you cause them to choke to death. That's why she was on the feeding tube. Veronica > [Original Message] > From: <Eternitytime1@xxxxxxx> > To: <lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> > Date: 3/27/2005 8:15:42 PM > Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: Right to Life, Right to Die > > > In a message dated 3/27/2005 8:29:01 AM Central Standard Time, > aamago@xxxxxxxxxxxxx writes: > The bottom > line is, her parents got parental urges long after Terry needed them. > > > Dear Andy, > And you say that I have preconceived notions? How about the thought that > they were so worried about her that when Michael decided to move her to Florida > that they shortly followed in order to be able to see her? (one of the > hallmarks of domestic violence is isolating people from those you love and who > love you--whether emotionally [the only reason they like 'us' is because of > me--you are so stupid/ugly/whatever that it is a good thing that I am in your > life/she does not want to see you any longer/etc.] or physically). > > I'm not saying that there was abuse or not--but you are definitely writing > as though you believe that someone who ends up within a domestic violence > situation (and men do as well as women, you know) -- that they 'deserve' it > because she/he was hoodwinked into marriage and then unable to return to her > parents if a shelter was 'beneath' her? I do not think you know a thing about > domestic violence and what happens to someone in that sort of situation, do > you? And, this has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not I was a former > member of the 'religious right', btw. On *average* it takes about seven > times for a woman (maybe men too--that I do not know--and Carol can tell me if > the statistics have changed...) to actually complete the leaving process. > > You have absolutely no idea what courage it takes, after years of abuse, to > be able to even contemplate leaving. And, MOST women do not even know where > to go for help--and even those who would and are trying to help them do not > have any idea as to go for help. And, that is if they are able to figure out > what, exactly, is "wrong". > > I do not think you have any idea what happens to family members when a > member of their family is involved with someone who is abusive (esp if they do not > know and then find out--just see the changes in the one they love...and what > if Terri was so Catholic that divorce was not really an option for her--and > the parents wanted her to do so [mine did me but I was trapped by my > 'vow'...so I do know a little what it is like to be trapped...])...Do you? > > I cannot imagine not being able to be in the room with my child when he was > dying. I simply cannot. I do not think that has anything to do with > 'adjudging' Michael. I admit it is really hard hard hard to simply evaluate his > behavior and be SO thankful and hopeful--thankful that my child will never > ever be like that to someone's parents and hopeful that I will not have to deal > with someone like him as a wife for my child. If he did not see her as > having any sort of life and feeling--then what would it have hurt to have let them > try?? I simply do not understand. If it is not going to hurt her and may > not even help her--but would help THEM and they are her parents--then why not? > I do not understand. And, keeping them from their daughter (and I do not > believe you EVER stop being a parent--ever--though you may try to allow for > healthy boundaries which is what I think they did...and how dare YOU judge > what sort of parents they were because she had an eating disorder! Is every > problem a child has because of bad parenting? None of us are here to learn and > to grow on our own? > > If saying that Michael's behavior smacks of power-control issues--and that > he is not healthy in how he acts when he has that power or this would not be > what happens: > > I got this from my sweet dear friend who is an "aging activist" (and not a > member of the 'Religious Right' by any stretch of the imagination...) > > "I understand the husband occasionally lets them "visit" for short periods > but they ofter go 10-12 hours without being able to see her. There is a > policeman at the door and someone in the room whenever they are there to assure > she gets no liquid from them. Sad case that certainly makes the case for > Assisted Suicide. I assume you are aware that Oregon has such a law as do a > number of countries in Europe...i.e. Denmark, Holland, Sweden. Some say its > really devastating the population in Holland...and many comparisons are being made > to Hitler's destruction of those mentally or physically handicapped. The > cost to the state is a burden. > > Glad the hospice is attempting to keep her comfortable. That, indeed is > palliative care, but normally they would try to spoon feed or give a little > water as part of palliative care - but the judge denied that." > " > > I apologize for being so cross in tone and words--but to blame any woman for > domestic violence is coming too close to home to me and for me. I will end > up saying things that I would prefer not to say. > > Blame the victim--oooh, yes. If she was abused, it was her fault and she > deserved to stay there if she was. THAT sounds more like a 'religious > right'/neo-conservative sort of thing to say than anything that *I* would EVER say. > (They are poor because they had bad parents and if they stay poor that is > because they deserve it because if they didn't, they would find a way out...) > > and I do try to assist people in not being EITHER the victims or the > victimizers--but to look for that third option. > > <deep breath[s]> and <mental refocusing to find the 'good'> > > Will you give me permission to forward that part of your post which both > connects me with the "religious right" and also invalidates pretty much ANYTHING > that I might ever ever say? I can think of people who have invalidated > pretty much ANYTHING that I might ever ever say by calling me part of the > opposite(s) of the "relgious right". > > Obviously not part of any group and thoughts and words invalidated by almost > everyone, > Marlena in Missouri > [glad to have gone exploring today and having a sweet day today before > reading this post] > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------ > To change your Lit-Ideas settings (subscribe/unsub, vacation on/off, > digest on/off), visit www.andreas.com/faq-lit-ideas.html ------------------------------------------------------------------ To change your Lit-Ideas settings (subscribe/unsub, vacation on/off, digest on/off), visit www.andreas.com/faq-lit-ideas.html