[lit-ideas] Re: Ideology vs Experience

  • From: "Simon Ward" <sedward@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • To: <lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Fri, 29 Sep 2006 00:50:01 +0100

Lawrence, my assertion is a simple one. The war in Iraq has caused moderate 
muslims to be attracted to fundamentalist ideology. Because of the war (which, 
it should be noted, had nothing to do with 9/11), there are now more 
fundamentalist muslims than there were before. Because of the war in Iraq, 
people died in Madrid and London. 

Now, you'll be blaming Qutb for coming up with the ideology, but of course, the 
moderates wouldn't be interested in it without them perceiving western 

Do you accept that the war in Iraq has created more fundamentlists than there 
were before? 


  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Lawrence Helm 
  To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
  Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 12:13 AM
  Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: Ideology vs Experience


  You forget that this all stated with Judy quibbling over my reference to 
Sayyid Qutb's ideology being the root cause of modern Militant Islam.  What on 
earth did I mean by "root cause," etc., etc.  Well, I explained that.  But, 
said someone who hadn't read Qutb, what about what the West did to the Middle 
East in modern times?  Well, said someone who had read Qutb, Qutb deals with 
that in some detail.  So this quibble seemed to dwindle into whether there was 
something the West had done to the Middle East that Qutb hadn't covered, but 
you, who had not read Qutb persevered in asserting that there was much, much, 
much that Qutb hadn't covered that the west had done to the Middle East that 
had caused the Islamists to behave as they do.


  And then when I introduce something real, something not the vague speculation 
you have hitherto engaged in, something going on right now in Germany, you 
sniff, "sorry, but I'm not playing hypotheticals . . ."  Gosh, Simon, what do 
you think you have been playing?  Not fact because you haven't read Qutb and 
haven't all this time known what you were talking about.



  From: lit-ideas-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:lit-ideas-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] 
On Behalf Of Simon Ward
  Sent: Thursday, September 28, 2006 3:57 PM
  To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
  Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: Ideology vs Experience

  Sliding out of it again Lawrence? Wouldn't expect anything else, but then I 
suppose I did give you the opportunity. More fool me.

  Sorry, but I'm not playing hypotheticals and also reject you're accusation of 
wishful thinking. Do you really think I'd be pleased to note that the Iraq War 
has served to turn so many moderates into fundamentalists. I can imagine how 
that might please you, but not me I assure you.


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