[lit-ideas] Re: Facing the Music
- From: Omar Kusturica <omarkusto@xxxxxxxxx>
- To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2015 23:53:52 +0100
D: The distinction between the W1, W2 and W3 aspects are not often observed
in ordinary language because it is not usually necessary to draw the
distinctions - if I say "I heard my brother say yesterday that he was going
to the dentist" what I intend to convey by this need not be encumbered by
distinguishing the various W1, W2 or W3 aspects that underpin my statement.
*I wonder what circumstances would mandate making such a distinction at
all.
O.K.
On Thu, Jan 22, 2015 at 11:27 PM, Donal McEvoy <donalmcevoyuk@xxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
> "It might seem that to take 'face the music' literally, the reference
> must
> be to W1, not W3. Since a 'face' belongs in W1 and an item of W1 (to use
> Popper's jargon) can only 'face' an item in the same world W1."
>
> Not so fast. For example, we may see or hear W3 content via physical W1
> sense organs - the key for Popper is that where W1 sense experience gives
> us access to W3 it does so only via W2. So we might consciously have to
> face the music in whatever "literal" sense - in which case, the correct
> account of this may involve the interaction of W1, W2 and W3 contents.
>
> The distinction between the W1, W2 and W3 aspects are not often observed
> in ordinary language because it is not usually necessary to draw the
> distinctions - if I say "I heard my brother say yesterday that he was going
> to the dentist" what I intend to convey by this need not be encumbered by
> distinguishing the various W1, W2 or W3 aspects that underpin my statement.
>
> D
> L
>
>
> On Thursday, 22 January 2015, 18:56, "dmarc-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxx" <
> dmarc-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
>
> The implicatures.
>
> My last post today.
>
> In a message dated 1/22/2015 1:33:39 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
> ewf@xxxxxxxxxxxxx writes:
> Hello Omar, We do, but I'm uncertain of any correlation. Here's what my
> Historical Dictionary of Slang (Farmer and Henley, London, 1890) says:
> The
> term is American (not Balkan!) in origin. But you knew that. It goes on
> the say: J. Fenimore Cooper derived it from the green-room, whence actors
> go
> on the boards and literally 'face the music.' Another traces it to
> militia
> musters, where every man is expected to appear equipped and armed, when
> in
> rank and file, facing the music. A third derives it from drumming out of
> the army. It then cites use of the term in American newspapers circa 1857
> and 1889. So except for the James Fenimore Cooper derivation, this
> largely
> agrees with the article you posted. I couldn't find any reference to
> funeral
> music, but who knows--the term's origins are rather uncertain it would
> seem.
>
>
> >>and literally 'face the music'.
>
> This might interest McEvoy (or not).
>
> I did a search in Google for "he literally faced the music". Two hits
> retrieved:
>
> Western Animation/Chowder - Television Tropes & Idioms
> tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/.../Chowder
> Traduci questa pagina
>
> "As punishment, he (literally) faced the music by having them sing the
> show's theme song. Chowder hummed along while Shnitzel begged them to
> stop."
>
> Chowder - All The Tropes Wiki
> allthetropes.wikia.com/wiki/Chowder
> Traduci questa pagina
>
> "As punishment, he (literally) faced the music by having them sing the
> show's theme song. Chowder hummed along while Shnitzel begged them to
> stop."
>
> Actually, two hits of the same collocation.
>
> It might seem that to take 'face the music' literally, the reference must
> be to W1, not W3. Since a 'face' belongs in W1 and an item of W1 (to use
> Popper's jargon) can only 'face' an item in the same world W1.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Speranza
>
>
>
>
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