[lit-ideas] Re: Comparing Empires

  • From: palma <palmaadriano@xxxxxxxxx>
  • To: "lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx" <lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2014 11:24:54 +0200

the truth is that bryce is grice, as the spice is the worm


On Mon, Apr 14, 2014 at 7:52 PM, <Jlsperanza@xxxxxxx> wrote:

> In a message dated 4/14/2014 8:40:57 A.M.  Eastern Daylight Time,
> omarkusto@xxxxxxxxx writes:
> James Bryce is an author  who definitely compared the Roman and the British
> modes of imperial  administration, particularly the administration in
> India. His essay "The Ancient  Roman Empire and
> the British Empire in India" is here:
> http://socserv2.mcmaster.ca/~econ/ugcm/3ll3/bryce/TwoHistoricalStudies.pdf
>
>
> This is a good link. For the record, Wikipedia has an entry on Bryce, who
> was ambassador to the USA, and a native of Ireland, as I recall. He is best
> known, the Wikipedia entry says, as a Byzantinist, but apparently he hated
> the  label (* Oddly this reminds me of Grice *) -- but he did write a story
> of the  later Empire (Oddly, in Italian 'history' and 'story' are NOT
> distinguished! --  do not multiply senses beyond necessity).
>
> It would have been good if Bryce just focused on comparing Roman Empire and
>  Brtish Empire _simpliciter_ rather than "British Empire IN INDIA" as he
> does --  which takes away some of the general interest his study might
> otherwise have!  But apparently the two things were _pretty_ different.
>
> L. Helm was wondering about 'fruitful comparisons', borrowing a phrase from
>  Historum. In the case of Bryce, I do wonder. The thing, published circa
> 1914 I  think, by the Clarendon Press (typically) may have been
> influential --
> and  perhaps taught a lesson or two to the Oxford-educated Civil Servants
> that  populated India back then.
>
> Incidentally, Bryce has a lot of titles.
>
> He is The Right Honourable The Viscount Bryce OM GCVO PC FRS FBA -- if you
> mustn't!
>
> The site Omar K. mentions comprises two studies by Bryce: this comparison
> and one on Roman Law and British Law.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Speranza
>
> * Once J. L. Austin said to Grice, "Trouble with you is you don't care what
>  the dictionary says" "I don't. I actually give a hoot what the dictionary
> says".  "And that's where you make your big mistake". The next day Grice
> did
> follow  Austin's advice. He started to browse the Oxford Concise
> Dictionary, from A to  Z. He was then analysing 'feeling aggravated',
> ;feeling
> amazed', 'feeling angry'  but he stopped when he reached 'byzantine' for
> he found
> he could find an  implicature, even, for 'I'm feeling rather byzantine
> today." * *
>
> ** Seriously, it's a good thing that Bryce is called a Byzantinist,
> although he said he was writing on Roman history simpliciter. He possibly
> rejected the idea that the Roman Empire comprised two parts: occidentalis
> and
> orientalis. As history goes, the attempt of Byzantine reconquest was an
> interesting thing and left a mark or two if only in ecclesiastical
>  architecture!
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