We are considering Eichmann's terse reply in the trial armed against him: "Befehl ist Befehl". As R. Paul remarked, 'he said more than that'. In fact, most of what he was said, however, was said by his lawyers. ("We brought our translators, just in case"). McEvoy comments about Eichmann's reply: While a patent tautology, the referential status is controversial. Only in 'befehl' at time t1 'befehl' at time t2 = t1 is the uttering of the phrase the uttering of a tautology. As he puts it, In a message dated 5/26/2010 5:58:14 A.M., donalmcevoyuk@xxxxxxxxxxx writes: > Befehl ist Befehl Only if the first "Befehl" means the same as the second. (Cf. "The King is dead, long live the King"). ----- The obvious objection here is 1953. "The King is dead, long live the Queen." While it may be argued that 'the queen' and 'the king' don't mean the same thing, it is less unproblematic to argue similarly for 'the king' and 'the king'. It seems that it is a matter of IMPLICATURE at play. Surely, if you have JUST said, "the king is dead" it would be contradictory to express your desire that "the king live long" ---- For you have just said that he was dead, so how can he live long? The point, as McEvoy notes, is Fregean. It's the identity of indiscernibles. Only in a purely denotational sense, 'the king' in the first clause ("the king is dead") does not refer to what it does in the second clause ("the king live[s] long") Note that the phrase, 'live', is subjunctive; so a case may be made that it means, 'atemporal'. Meaning something like, "The king died, but we all wished, when he first was elected king, that he would live a long life, a sentiment that we ironically express at this sad moment in his 'life' (or 'death')'. ---- "Befehl ist Befehl" seems to work differently. While 'is' is indeed the copula, the passage of time here seems uncontroversial, in that there is none. Cfr. "My wife isn't what she USED to be" But surely "My wife is my wife" is still tautologous. Plus, 'Befehl' is an abstract noun: 'order' "An order is an order". This is different from "Boys will be boys" which, only under the proper interpretation, 'boy' = 'servant', makes sense. In terms of age, indeed the second 'boys' should scare: "Boys will be 'boys'". ---- "Befehl ist Befehl" works like Grice's example: "War is war" only different. He also gives the example: "Women are women". "In this case, the implicature seems to be: what's the point in trying to understand them?" ---- With 'war is war', said in a different tone, the implicature is "All's fair in love and war" ----- But Eichmann knew that! J. L. Speranza Bordighera ------------------------------------------------------------------ To change your Lit-Ideas settings (subscribe/unsub, vacation on/off, digest on/off), visit www.andreas.com/faq-lit-ideas.html