[lit-ideas] Re: Aren't you glad you no longer have a Hitler problem?

  • From: JimKandJulieB@xxxxxxx
  • To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
  • Date: Sat, 24 Jun 2006 21:42:21 EDT

Somewhere in your e-mail I'm missing the mention of the Christian  
Crusades....
 
Julie Krueger

========Original  Message========     Subj: [lit-ideas] Re: Aren't you glad 
you no longer have a Hitler  problem?  Date: 6/24/06 7:03:25 P.M. Central 
Daylight Time  From: _lawrencehelm@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
(mailto:lawrencehelm@xxxxxxxxxxxx) 
  To: _lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx (mailto:lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx)   Sent on:   
 

This stuff is well  known Mike.  Wahhabism originated in Saudi Arabia in the 
18th  Century.  Salafism came along later.  They were both Fundamentalist in  
nature.  Maududi wrote and was very influential in the days before and  after 
Pakistan became an independent nation.  The Muslim Brothers,  influenced by 
Wahhabism, were influential about the same time in Egypt.   Sayyid Qutb was a 
Muslim Brother.  The Shiite equivalent was just as  influential if not more so 
through the work of Khomeini.  Islamism is a (if  not the) predominant 
religious viewpoint in the Middle East.  It is not a  small fringe belief held 
by a 
few radicals.  Osama bin Laden is but one  follower of the teachings of Sayyid 
Qutb.  Yes, in earlier times Islam was  more peaceful, but we donât live in 
those times.   
However, you are  mistaken in arguing that Islam was more peaceful than 
Christianity or  Judaism.  Islam has always been militant.  It encountered 
Judaism 
and  Christianity by conquering nations that held those beliefs.   Muslim  
slaughtered Christians for about 200 years before the first crusade was 
launched  
to regain the Holy Lands.   
Colonization of the  Middle East?  What are you talking about?  Algeria was 
colonized by  the French but that is the only nation in the Middle East that 
was colonized to  the best of my recollection.  I hope you arenât saying that 
Israel was a  colony.   
Do you want to know  whom we are fighting when we are fighting back?  We are 
fighting against  the Militant Islamists who have declared war against us.  
You must have  noticed that they have been attacking us.  Their attacks 
escalated until  9/11 and then we decided to fight back.  You must have missed 
it.  So 
 you think these people who have declared war against us and attacked us are  
innocent people?  That is an interesting viewpoint but difficult to prove.  
Someone attacking you, your family, your friends or your allies isnât  
normally 
going to come across as innocent. 
Iraq not the  enemy?  Iraq had a Baathist form of government influenced by 
Nassar which  advocated Pan-Arabism.  This was the modern equivalent of the 
Ummah  advocated by Mohammad.  The Ummah doesnât have borders.  It is one  
people. 
 Saddam sought to achieve Pan-Arabism.  It was his ambition  and he pursued 
it with diligence until he was at last stopped by UN forces in  1991.  He was 
stopped but hadnât given up his dream.  And you think  Saddam and his Sunni 
Baathists innocent?  One needs a hefty set of blinders  to believe that.  
Baathists and Islamists had roughly the same goals.   They disagreed as to who 
ought 
to run things. 
Islamism and its  Baathist equivalent is organized murder.  It is evil.  It  
wholeheartedly needs to be opposed. 
Lawrence 
-----Original Message-----
From:  lit-ideas-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:lit-ideas-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] 
On Behalf  Of Mike Geary
Sent: Saturday, June 24, 2006 4:23 PM
To:  lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: Aren't you glad you no  longer have a Hitler 
problem? 
LH: 
>>Read Sayyid Qutb.  He has written  voluminously.  Qutb came to the US and  
>>studied at a college in Colorado where he  developed a negative opinion of  
>>Americans.  They are a decadent  people.<< 
Well, yes, according to his strictures we are.   Does that surprise you?  So  
too are we according to Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson  and most the far  
right Christians. 
>> But his opinion isn't what modern Leftists  would have us believe today.  
>> 9/11 wasn't a response to anything the US  did.  It was a response to what 
 
>> the US is - a nation of infidels.  All  infidels must convert or be  
>> destroyed.<< 
Sayyid Qutb might believe that, but Islam doesn't.   Over the centuries Islam 
 
has been far more tolerant of other beliefs than  Christianity which has  
slaughtered and assaulted both Jews and Muslims for over  a thousand years. 
>>There is no other way as far as militant Islam  is concerned.<< 
Bullshit.  Until Western nations started colonizing  the Middle East there  
was no problem.  STOP THE COLONIZATION OF THE  MIDDLE EAST!!!  GET IT???? 
>> As far as some of us in the US are concerned,  however, there is another  
>> way.  I know you won't approve, but it's  called FIGHTING BACK.<< 
Fighting back?  Fighting whom?  People who had  nothing to do with the  
assault on America?  That's who we're  fighting.  Innocent people.  This war  
is a gross injustice.  A travesty.  A crime  against humanity. 
>> It's tough to do with so many in America  routing for America's enemies << 
The people of Iraq are NOT our enemy.  Get that  through your thick head.  
The people of Iraq are NOT our enemy.  Al Qaeda  is.  We gave up that fight 3 
 
years ago to invade Iraq in pursuit of cheap oil.   Can't you see that?  Iraq 
 
has nothing to do with your would-be enemy Sayyid  Qutb.  Admit it, Lawrence, 
 
the Bushies got it all wrong.  Admit that 2500  American soldiers have died  
for a neo-con fantasy, that tens of thousands of Iraqis  have died in the  
name of General Motors.  It's all wrong,  Lawrence.  There's no moral  
justification for our killing Iraqis.  It's  murder.  It's evil.  Amen. 
Mike Geary 
Memphis 

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